Up next in 10
This week: We’re unpacking all the week’s WWDC announcements — Siri AI, new Apple Intelligence features, Liquid Glass changes and all the software features Apple didn’t talk about! Plus: Our WWDC prediction results…
More Apple news: http://www.cultofmac.com
Produced by Extra Ordinary for Cult of Mac
Music composed by Will Davenport, arranged by D. Griffin Jones
Chapters:
0:00 - Intro
1:03 - The new Siri AI
25:32 - Apple Intelligence in the EU
43:37 - Listener Question
45:50 - Other new Apple Intelligence features
1:00:53 - macOS Golden Gate 27
1:11:52 - watchOS 27
1:21:03 - Prediction Results
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Show More Show Less View Video Transcript
0:00
Coming up, we're unpacking all this
0:02
week's WWDC announcements, Siri AI, new
0:06
Apple intelligence features, liquid
0:08
glass changes, and all the software
0:10
features Apple didn't talk about, plus
0:13
our dubdub DC prediction results.
0:17
[music]
0:18
Welcome to the Cult podcast. I'm your
0:20
host, Leander Kenny. Joining me today,
0:22
we have some good friends from overseas,
0:26
Charlie Sorell. Hey, Charlie.
0:28
>> Hey. How you doing? Very good. Thank
0:30
you. Uh we have Senor Graham from
0:32
Barcelona. Hello Graeme.
0:34
>> Hola.
0:36
[laughter]
0:37
>> D Griffin Jones from Ohio.
0:39
>> Good evening.
0:41
>> All right. And uh Lewis from just up the
0:43
street. Hello, Louis.
0:44
>> Hey, how's it going?
0:45
>> All right. How hot are you, Louis? I'm
0:47
so hot I'm melting.
0:48
>> It's uh it's oddly I think cuz I've got
0:51
all the blinds closed in this room. It's
0:53
not that hot in this room yet, but I
0:54
walked out into the other part of the
0:56
house and he has like, "Yeah, it's
0:57
actually warm in San Francisco today."
0:59
>> Yeah, creepy. It's about 300° in here.
1:03
>> All right, let's talk about uh get on
1:05
with the show so we don't waste
1:06
everyone's time. Uh Siri, major redesign
1:09
chat interface and dedicated app. Now, I
1:11
got to say I was impressed with this. I
1:12
thought it was actually, you know, it
1:14
looked great after all these years. So,
1:17
Apple smart assistant Siri has been
1:18
reinvented as Siri AI with a new range
1:20
of advanced capabilities and its own
1:22
dedicated app. During the keynote, Apple
1:24
showed Siri AI engaging in multi-turn
1:26
interactions pulling personal data from
1:28
several sources and searching the web
1:30
for real-time data. Uh, as well as
1:32
iPhone, iPad, and Mac. Siri AI has also
1:34
come to Apple Watch and the Vision Pro
1:36
headset. There's also a new
1:38
crossplatform Siri AI app that reminds
1:40
prior conversations
1:42
that remembers prior conversations and
1:43
syncs them uh via iCloud so the
1:45
conversations carry seamlessly between
1:47
devices. Uh during the keynote, Keg
1:49
Federigi, Apple software chief said,
1:51
quote, "Apple intelligence uses ondevice
1:53
processing as well as private iCloud
1:55
compute which ensures your data is not
1:57
stored or accessible to Apple or anyone
1:59
else. Your data is used is only used to
2:02
execute your request and outside experts
2:05
can continue to verify this promise at
2:07
any time. So, has anyone actually uh I'm
2:10
on the wait list. Have you any of you
2:12
guys uh managed to get hold of it yet?
2:15
>> Uh I I applied basically an hour after
2:20
the keynote ended. I installed the betas
2:22
and uh got myself on the wait list and
2:25
it took me about I mean I took
2:27
screenshots of this because I had to
2:29
write an article later that day. So I
2:30
actually have the time stamps of when I
2:32
applied and when I got in and it was
2:33
like 3:00 p.m. to like 5:30 p.m. So 2
2:37
and a half hours. But now I see people
2:40
are waiting several days to get in the
2:42
wait list. It's you know they did this
2:44
last time they had the first Apple
2:46
intelligence features. they had a wait
2:47
list for it and I don't remember it
2:49
being that extreme of a wait. I mean to
2:52
be honest I don't even really know why
2:53
there is a wait list at all but [snorts]
2:56
>> well it's probably to stop their their
2:57
servers from getting hammered. No, I
2:59
imagine
2:59
>> yeah there's a if you're uh if you're
3:02
doing on the Mac you can bypass the the
3:05
weight list with a default write command
3:08
in the terminal.
3:09
>> Mhm.
3:10
>> Uh Mac Rumors wrote about it today. Uh
3:12
so yeah just um yeah uh
3:16
>> thanks Charlie for ruining our podcast
3:18
>> behavior I would expect from you. You're
3:20
just jumping cutting in line.
3:23
>> Okay. [laughter]
3:24
>> Well
3:25
>> have you tried it out on your Mac
3:26
Charlie or you about it?
3:28
>> No no I'm not installing anything like
3:29
that on my Mac especially if as I'm
3:31
recording a podcast. I don't know who
3:33
would do that kind of thing. Griffin.
3:34
Oh, no. That that would be ridiculous to
3:36
install developer beta 1 on your primary
3:39
Mac where you do all of your work.
3:42
That's exactly what I did. I'm I'm I'm
3:43
speaking to you right now from Golden
3:45
Gate.
3:45
>> Plus, uh even if you stick this uh
3:47
default right command in there, it will
3:50
not work in the EU anyway. It's still,
3:52
you know, you still need to still
3:54
>> because you're allowed to use Mac and
3:57
Vision Pro uh with uh a Siri AI in the
4:00
EU. Oh,
4:02
>> my gatekeeper devices.
4:05
>> So, you can't you can't use it on uh
4:07
iPhone and iPad. You can even use it on
4:09
Apple Watch, which I think is a bit
4:11
bizarre because uh Apple Watch, I'm
4:13
sure, just offloads it to your iPhone
4:15
anyway. Um but yeah, my understanding is
4:18
you can use it on a Mac in the EU.
4:20
>> Well, my understanding is that the Apple
4:22
Watch does not offload it to the iPhone
4:24
anymore. That's why watch OS 27 has such
4:29
an aggressive cut off for hardware and
4:32
that's why workout buddy now runs
4:34
directly on the Apple Watch without a
4:35
nearby iPhone because it's it's doing it
4:38
on the watch.
4:39
>> So it's using the neural engines on the
4:41
on the watch itself. Wow.
4:43
>> What did you think of the the the you
4:45
know I mean two years ago Apple promised
4:47
a smarter Siri they failed to bring it
4:49
to uh you know to get it out and then
4:52
finally we got our eyes on it. What did
4:54
you think of it overall? Do you know?
4:56
Were you impressed or
4:57
>> I mean, this is basically everything
4:59
they announced two years ago, except
5:01
you'll notice like during the keynote,
5:02
so many of the takes they did were all
5:04
one shot. They had like a a split screen
5:07
where they had both Mike Rockwell's face
5:09
and like his his hand holding the phone.
5:11
And you can see like his hand moves
5:13
exactly the same way in both of those
5:15
shots. It is like a live shot of both of
5:17
them. You know, he gestures with his
5:19
hands naturally when he's, you know, not
5:21
presenting to camera. And so sometimes
5:23
like you can they if they were
5:25
pre-recording this they would have done
5:26
multiple takes of that but they wanted
5:28
it to like be obvious like no this is
5:30
all one shot.
5:31
>> It kind of worked against them didn't it
5:33
because it made it look slow.
5:34
>> I think it made it look I mean it didn't
5:36
wasn't that slow and I I like that they
5:38
were not like chopping it. I I can't
5:40
remember who somebody wrote a blog post
5:43
about this and said you know if if the
5:46
if it's slow if the demo is slow the you
5:48
don't cut it. That's not the way to fix
5:50
it. the the the fix is to speed up the
5:52
feature.
5:53
>> I think it feels slow because the rest
5:55
of the keynote is so tightly edited
5:57
>> that you then cut to like one long
5:59
continuous take of this and then it just
6:01
feels slow relatively. But I mean when
6:03
I'm actually using it, it feels
6:05
perfectly fast. Like it's normal for a
6:07
Siri interaction to take like a couple
6:09
seconds to go through. We're all used to
6:11
that. We're just not used to watching
6:12
Apple demos be slow anymore.
6:15
>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I I was really
6:18
impressed and I was and I was kind of
6:19
like glad that they didn't um show all
6:22
kind of crazy stuff like agentic Siri,
6:24
you know, going out and booking you an
6:26
entire holiday. It seemed very grounded.
6:28
It seemed to be very um
6:31
uh you know, feature focused.
6:34
>> So, it was it was improving, you know,
6:36
current capabilities rather than the
6:37
sort of you know, crazy far off future
6:40
stuff. Um and it looks like it delivers.
6:43
You know, I mean, some of that stuff
6:44
looked looked kind of cra I've seen some
6:46
stuff on on the socials like what people
6:48
are doing. Max Weinback this morning
6:50
said he he got some spam email and uh he
6:53
said, "Okay, move all the emails from
6:55
this domain into my junk folder." Bang.
6:57
It did it.
6:58
>> That kind of stuff looks crazy helpful,
7:00
you know, like it looks it looks very
7:03
very impressive. I think it looks really
7:05
>> As long as it works though. I mean, it's
7:06
fine to have a demo say that or even to
7:08
do it, but like how do you trust that
7:10
it's actually moved all of those emails
7:13
and not um you know, moved ones that you
7:16
don't want from different domains?
7:17
>> Yeah.
7:18
>> Without going to check
7:19
>> and that because that's the thing, we we
7:22
unless
7:23
>> well, you got to test it, but I I don't
7:25
see how it's actually going to be any
7:26
better than any other AIS and they're
7:28
pretty unreliable for most things like
7:30
this.
7:31
>> Well, it's so tightly integrated into
7:32
the into into the operating system,
7:34
isn't it? and all your data as well. Um,
7:36
>> but yeah, uses Spotlight though, that's
7:37
the other thing I'm worried about cuz
7:38
spot I can't find stuff with Spotlight
7:40
half the time, you know? [laughter]
7:42
>> That's a good point.
7:43
>> Well, supposedly they've redone how all
7:44
of that is indexed. Like they especially
7:46
called out mail indexing is much better
7:49
than before. And like I can't remember
7:51
the last time that I've done a search in
7:53
mail and found what I wanted really
7:55
quickly, but [laughter]
7:57
>> much better than before means it kind
7:59
of, you know, basically works now rather
8:02
than doesn't work at all.
8:03
>> Yeah. Yeah. So, we'll see how that
8:04
works. But, like I've I've been asking
8:06
the the the new Siri a number of things
8:09
to test it out. Uh, the first question I
8:11
asked was, "Who has the tallest hair on
8:14
the Cult of Mac podcast?" And it said,
8:17
"I could not confirm which host on the
8:18
Cult of Mac podcast has the tallest
8:20
hair." The hosts of the podcast, also
8:23
known as the cult cast, are Airfon,
8:25
Elijah, Lewis Wallace, and Driffin
8:26
Jones.
8:27
>> There you go. So,
8:29
>> fantastic question. You're like
8:30
Maleficent from Snow White. I just
8:32
[laughter]
8:34
Who is the most beautiful with most
8:36
luxurant podcaster? [laughter]
8:39
>> Who is the most luxurious hair? Yeah.
8:41
>> No, just flying into a rage when I said
8:44
Earth on Elijah is the most beautiful
8:46
podcaster on [laughter]
8:49
>> Yeah, you should have asked who has any
8:50
hair on the podcast. [laughter]
8:52
>> But I' I've asked a number of questions
8:54
like there was the the thing last year
8:55
where everybody was causing a fuss like
8:57
if you ask Siri who won the Super Bowl
8:59
from each year, it'll just give you
9:00
completely random information. So that
9:02
was a thing I tested, you know, who won
9:04
the Super Bowl in 1997, Green Bay
9:06
Packers and it told me the score and I
9:08
checked on week. What I noticed is that
9:10
uh sometime usually if you're asking a
9:12
question to chat TBT, you have to tell
9:14
it provide me a source for it to like
9:15
give you a link most of the time. See,
9:18
the new series seems to do that
9:19
automatically. Like I didn't ask for it,
9:21
but it gives me like a link to Wikipedia
9:23
and two other sites. Um, I tried
9:27
replicating a few of the things that
9:28
Mike Rockwell asks with by asking like
9:30
similar questions. Uh, like he asks,
9:32
"When's this uh, artist like performing
9:35
in San Francisco?" And so I asked,
9:37
"Well, when's Phoebe Brides touring in
9:40
Detroit?" Because my friends are
9:41
actually booking a trip to that show.
9:43
And so I know what the correct
9:45
information is. and gives me the date,
9:47
the time, which it was actually kind of
9:49
hard to find the time online to verify
9:52
it because it's like hidden in ticket
9:53
master, but it was able to find it
9:55
faster than I could. I said, "How do I
9:57
get tickets?" And it says, you know, the
9:59
general sale public goes on sale this
10:01
day. The official artist pre-sale is at
10:03
this date and time. And, you know,
10:05
remind me to set up when the lottery
10:07
opens. It added a reminder. Um, I asked
10:10
it to play one of the upcoming singles.
10:12
And it took a while. I was asking on the
10:15
Mac and it would probably would have
10:16
been faster on the phone just because
10:18
the music app is much better on iOS than
10:20
it is on the Mac. Like it says okay
10:22
generating link thinking finding. It
10:25
briefly shows me this bizarre link URL
10:28
that I don't recognize. Then it says
10:29
thinking thinking and then it started
10:32
playing it in Apple Music. Uh but it did
10:35
work.
10:36
>> How do you think this is going to go?
10:37
Because right now Siri is something that
10:38
everyone uses. It doesn't work and then
10:40
no one uses it anymore. Uh
10:42
>> I think it'll take a long time to build
10:44
up the trust because [clears throat]
10:46
>> if you tell like right now when you use
10:49
Siri it says, "Oh, these are the kinds
10:51
of things you can ask me." But like if
10:53
it's so open-ended, it'll be hard for
10:55
people to imagine I have this problem.
10:58
Oh, I should ask Siri that. Uh because
11:01
it people need to build up like a an
11:05
understanding of these are the kinds of
11:06
things it can do. It'll take a long time
11:08
to build up that trust. Well, right. The
11:10
model memory um is is takes a little
11:12
while to to change your habits, doesn't
11:14
it?
11:14
>> Yeah.
11:15
>> Um
11:15
>> well, this is what I was thinking. I'm a
11:17
heavy user of like AI chat. I use chat
11:20
GBT and I use uh Claude a lot. And
11:23
[clears throat] I was thinking how would
11:24
this would I use this as well? Would I
11:26
use it instead of chat GPT and Claude
11:29
sometimes? I to me my my first
11:31
impression like the sniff test of it was
11:33
it looked a little bit fiddly and all
11:35
this business with the dynamic island
11:36
and those weird sort of two columns of
11:39
tiles of queries and stuff. It looked a
11:41
little bit overdesigned and my instinct
11:43
was as a as just a a chat assistant
11:47
Gemini is not quite as good as Claude
11:49
and chat GPT and so I I don't think it
11:52
would replace those for me. So I I I I
11:56
think it what what you Leandra and
11:58
Griffin were saying it is it's very much
12:00
the case that it's like it could be
12:02
useful because it can do things that
12:04
chatbt and Claude can't because it's
12:06
hooked directly into the data on my
12:08
iPhone. But it might take me a while to
12:10
get my head around when it is useful.
12:13
But my instinct is because the design
12:15
just looks so fiddly, I I might avoid
12:18
using it unless I have to. And the one
12:20
thing I was disappointed by actually was
12:23
the voice. you know, they said that
12:25
we've massively improved the voice and
12:27
to me it sounded just the same. And when
12:30
you compare the voices, you know, these
12:32
crazy voices, like sometimes I'll have a
12:33
a chat with chat GBT and uh it disturbs
12:38
me how realistic the voice is, you know,
12:40
after a while when you've chatted to it
12:41
for a long time, you get to know it
12:43
stick and it starts to sound a little
12:45
bit more oneote, but it's still much
12:48
more naturalistic than what Mike
12:50
Rockwell demonstrated. And I was a bit
12:52
surprised by that because I really
12:54
thought that they would sort of leap
12:56
into the modern day.
12:58
>> Which one are you using, Graeme? Because
13:00
aren't there a choice of five voices
13:01
now? Like I downloaded the British one
13:03
yesterday. I I haven't tried it out yet,
13:05
but actually I found that in the past,
13:07
you know, like um I it understood me
13:09
better if I use the British voice than
13:11
than if I use the American one.
13:13
>> I I I hate having assistants talk to me
13:15
with a British accent because it feels
13:16
like they're taking the Mickey, you
13:18
know. [laughter]
13:20
But you you talk to your assistants with
13:22
an American accent, Graeme.
13:23
>> Well, with Syria, I use an American
13:25
American pronunciation because it often
13:27
doesn't understand me otherwise.
13:29
>> H [laughter]
13:31
So, so can you give us an example of
13:32
your your fake American accent? The
13:34
>> set a timer for 10 minutes.
13:37
[laughter]
13:39
>> It's a little uncanny valley to me as an
13:41
American, but I mean, whatever works.
13:43
>> It works better. It works better. I will
13:46
say with regards to either interface, um
13:49
[snorts] it's
13:51
it it takes a little bit getting used to
13:52
on the iPhone like swiping down from the
13:54
top of the screen, but I mean I at first
13:57
I kept like trying to tap the dynamic
13:59
island thinking that's how it works
14:00
because that's how like German described
14:01
it in the rumors and then I realized no
14:02
no it's a swipe down like you're
14:04
bringing down notification center just
14:06
from the middle and then that brings up
14:08
Siri and have I think it's really nice
14:10
on the iPhone because like before you
14:12
know you could hold down the side button
14:14
to do it in voice mode or could double
14:16
tap on the bottom of the screen to type
14:18
and like they were two different systems
14:20
with two slightly different user
14:21
interfaces and I kept accidentally
14:23
bringing up the type to Siri all the
14:25
time because it's right there on the
14:26
bottom of the phone and like my palm
14:28
would
14:29
>> naturally hit it sometimes. Uh but I
14:31
didn't disable it because I do genuinely
14:33
like typing to Siri sometimes if I don't
14:35
want to speak my command out if I'm in a
14:37
room full of people, you know, but
14:39
having it from the top is really nice.
14:41
I'll say I find it a little more fiddly
14:43
on the Mac actually because now Siri and
14:46
Spotlight are the same. So I noticed
14:48
this just yesterday. I was talking to
14:50
Siri on my Mac and then I also wanted to
14:52
use Spotlight to open an app and I was
14:54
like, well, I'm in the middle of this.
14:57
So
14:58
>> then I remembered today that I have a
14:59
Tiny Start by by Neon on my Mac and so I
15:02
should just use that instead if I ever
15:04
cross those streams. But so they they
15:07
make they redesigned the look of it to
15:09
where it's like a really like black to
15:11
clear gradient on iPhone because it
15:13
lives on the dynamic island. But they're
15:15
going with that look everywhere. I think
15:18
because I use my Mac in light mode. It's
15:20
it it's like when I bring up Siri like
15:23
this black hole opens in the middle of
15:25
my screen. It looks very out of place.
15:27
>> I do think Apple's being a bit naughty
15:29
there with not respecting light and dark
15:32
mode. There's lots of apps where they
15:33
don't do that and it's not obvious why
15:35
like the fitness and uh yeah the fitness
15:38
app would be an example and the Apple
15:39
Watch app that they have dark mode
15:42
>> hardwired you can't have light mode and
15:45
uh yeah I I I think that's bad and now
15:47
in with iTunes or not iTunes Apple Music
15:50
now they they've started introducing
15:52
like they take the color from the cover
15:55
art and then they use that for the UI.
15:57
So, if you've got an album cover with a
16:00
white background, then even if you've
16:02
chosen dark mode, you suddenly get a
16:03
white background and vice versa. But
16:05
this seems to be the most egregious
16:07
example of it yet. And it's just cuz
16:09
they think it looks cool or they want to
16:11
brand it in some way. It reminds me a
16:13
bit of Apple in the olden days when you
16:16
know under Steve Jobs, they had the the
16:18
brushed metal look and they would give
16:20
brush metal to something that was
16:21
important. So, first of all, it was
16:23
QuickTime and then it was iTunes. And
16:26
that sort of made sense because they
16:27
wanted iTunes to look like a
16:28
>> an appliance.
16:29
>> But then in the end, it's like, oh,
16:30
we'll put it on the finder because we've
16:32
jazzed that up and they start sticking
16:34
it on all these different things. And I
16:35
think dark mode is one of those things
16:37
that Apple uses to say, oh, look, this
16:39
is a cool new thing that we've done. And
16:41
so, we kind of give it a different look.
16:44
But it it's it's inconsistent. And I I
16:46
think that that that was one of the
16:47
things I reacted to a bit when I was
16:49
looking at it. I I think the dark mode
16:52
came out of the fact that it comes from
16:53
the dynamic island and so if doing stuff
16:56
on the dynamic island it has to have a a
16:58
black background but then yeah from that
17:01
it kind of
17:02
>> but they also don't plan on having like
17:03
the dynamic island on iPhones forever
17:06
like you know that their their goal is
17:07
to have an all screen thing without a
17:09
black cutout in the top and so they're
17:11
like marrying Siri to this visual look
17:14
that's very tied in the dynamic island
17:15
like the sensor cutout but they I mean
17:18
the folding iPhone isn't going to have
17:19
one on the inside because in the middle
17:21
of the screen is going to be like a
17:22
crease. They can't have a black cutout
17:24
there. But like so already like within 3
17:27
months from now it won't make sense even
17:29
on the iPhone. Well, we've had so many
17:31
false dawns for Siri, and each time
17:33
there's a false dawn, there's a new
17:34
look. And so, you know, like the last
17:37
false dawn, like the notorious uh WWDC
17:40
2024, and they introduced a the sort of
17:43
Pride edition like rainbows around the
17:46
edge of the screen,
17:47
>> and you know, that was supposed to say,
17:49
look, Siri is great now, but it it's
17:51
obvious like they couldn't ship the new
17:53
Siri, but they couldn't resist shipping
17:54
the rainbows around the screen. So, we
17:56
got that anyway. So, they'd used that
17:58
and they needed a new new look. And I
18:00
guess whether we get stuck with this
18:01
austere black background and white text
18:04
look permanently depends on if they've
18:06
really fixed it this time. If they have,
18:08
then maybe
18:09
>> on on an even more minor note, I'm not a
18:12
fan of the icon. The icon is so like
18:15
there's a Siri app now, but the icon is
18:17
like white with like a it it looks
18:19
exactly like the old Pepsi logo that
18:21
everybody made fun of. It's and it has
18:23
like a black swirl in it that kind of
18:26
hints or alludes to like the, you know,
18:29
the the animated colorful waves, but I
18:31
like the colorful waves much more. I I
18:33
don't like how they they flattened it
18:35
into this black swirl.
18:37
>> I I think this is an ideological thing
18:39
because they had to build it with icon
18:41
composer. I think what they wanted it to
18:44
look like was the beautiful 3D marble
18:46
like glass crystal ball that they have
18:49
on Vision Pro. I think that's what they
18:51
wanted to do, but you can't do that with
18:52
icon composer because it has to be these
18:55
layers of liquid glass. So, they ended
18:57
up with something which is a bit of an
18:58
awkward compromise because it it it
19:01
doesn't look like the cool Siri globe,
19:04
it looks like a kind of cutout crude
19:06
version.
19:07
>> So, although although you're in in
19:09
Spain, you're in Europe, you still have
19:10
a UK Apple account, so you'll still have
19:14
access to the new Siri if you want to
19:15
use it, right, Graeme?
19:16
>> I I don't know if they're going to
19:18
geoblock it. I I haven't found that out
19:20
yet. But the the frustrating thing is
19:22
because my business is in Spain, then my
19:24
Apple developer account is Spanish.
19:27
[laughter]
19:29
>> What?
19:29
>> Just I'm just holding up a picture of
19:31
David Bowie holding his crystal ball in
19:33
the Labyrinth movie. And that's that's
19:35
the new Siri. [laughter]
19:38
>> Thank you for that purely visual joke uh
19:40
from the one person on the podcast who
19:42
doesn't show their video. I'll have to
19:43
edit that in now.
19:45
>> That's podcasting. Uh Lewis, what are
19:47
what are your opinions on on the new
19:49
Siri?
19:49
>> Yeah, it looks as good as it did in
19:51
2024. Uh seems like it works. I I
19:54
thought it was interesting the way they
19:56
they did it on the uh the demos, you
19:58
know. I mean, I too felt like it was
20:00
like, oh my god, it's like so slow, but
20:03
uh it was kind of reassuring in a way,
20:05
you know, like this actually seems like
20:07
it works.
20:07
>> And and and you know, I I thought of you
20:09
when they said this. They explicitly
20:11
mentioned how they improved the
20:12
dictation models.
20:14
>> Yeah. on a handful of devices.
20:18
[clears throat]
20:18
>> That's one of those things that's
20:19
limited to I think iPhone 17 Pro, right?
20:22
I don't even know if iPhone 17 gets
20:24
that. And that's
20:25
>> No, it's limited to the devices with the
20:27
A19 Pro chip, which are just the iPhone
20:30
Air and the 17 Pro.
20:32
>> I think it's iPads with an M4 or newer,
20:36
Macs with an M3 or newer, and obviously
20:39
only like the last two models of Apple
20:41
Watch. But um I guess there's a little
20:43
confusion about this. All of the devices
20:46
that currently support Apple
20:47
intelligence do get the new Siri. It's
20:49
just only those special more recent
20:52
devices get a larger ondevice model. So
20:55
which unlocks the better dictation and
20:58
also the new Siri voice. So I can't get
21:01
the new Siri voice on my 16 Pro.
21:04
>> Yeah. Well, uh you know that that was
21:05
like the one thing I was talking to my
21:07
wife about this. She's like, "Well, what
21:08
does Apple say this week?" And I said,
21:10
"Well, you got this new Siri. They got
21:11
this new uh, you know, bunch of design
21:13
tweaks and stuff. Mostly it's about Siri
21:15
and AI." And she's like, "Well, can can
21:16
it understand what you're saying now?"
21:18
Like, "Yeah,
21:20
>> well, actually, yeah, you have a iPhone
21:21
17 Pro, so yes, supposedly it will." Uh,
21:24
I mean, that that's got to be the
21:25
biggest kick in the teeth if you have
21:27
anything older than that iPhone wise,
21:29
and it's still going to be garbage, cuz
21:31
it is still garbage. I was reminded just
21:34
how garbage it is. you know, just this
21:35
week driving around. I cannot get it to
21:38
find a stupid song in Apple Music. I I
21:41
to for the life of me, I don't I mean, I
21:42
I sound like a broken record with this,
21:44
but that is such a frustrating
21:49
inability.
21:50
And I I just I don't even know how in
21:53
the world anybody who is in charge of
21:55
that is still employed. It's just
21:57
horrible.
21:58
>> Well, they had a pretty high-profile
22:00
person no longer employed, John Andrea.
22:03
So,
22:04
>> yeah. Yeah, they are. Well, we were
22:05
talking Louis and I were earlier about
22:07
the betas and and and whether we could
22:09
be, you know, download them and and and
22:11
to what and you know, for me, only my
22:14
iPhone and my maybe my Apple Watch Ultra
22:17
um supports it, but you know, I can't
22:19
run it on my Mac. I can't run it on my
22:21
my MacBook. I can't run it on my uh
22:23
iPad. They're all too old. Well, I can't
22:25
run the, you know, like you're saying,
22:27
the new models.
22:29
>> Um, which has got to be a frustration. I
22:31
wonder what the, you know, the installed
22:32
base is, how much uh what percentage of
22:35
the installed base can actually make use
22:36
of these um these new capabilities. You
22:39
know, it's got to be I don't know.
22:41
>> It doesn't include the MacBook Neo,
22:42
which is like currently still for sale.
22:45
>> And what's the limitation on M1? I
22:48
thought it was all M1 Max.
22:50
>> All M1 Max run Apple Intelligence, but
22:52
only M3 Max and newer
22:54
>> M3
22:54
>> have the have the ondevice models that
22:56
are better.
22:59
And do you know the the breakdown of the
23:01
different because there's actually five
23:02
different models now right that um Apple
23:05
intelligence does anyone know what the
23:06
breakdown is?
23:07
>> I don't think Apple has published or
23:09
even explains when is used in which
23:11
situation they have a they split up like
23:14
the the original Apple intelligence
23:16
foundation model like sort of
23:18
incorporated a bunch of stuff in one but
23:20
now they split it up so like the image
23:22
model is like completely different now.
23:24
It's like a separate entirely separate
23:26
thing that's trained independently I
23:27
think uh which is why it got so so much
23:31
better
23:32
>> than before.
23:33
>> I think it it there are going to be
23:35
improvements for those older phones as
23:37
well with you know but the the bit that
23:39
I was puzzled by was the way that they
23:42
said that they had merged their
23:44
foundation models with uh models from
23:47
Google Gemini and I wondered if that was
23:50
a little bit like it's like is that
23:52
true? I don't know how you merge models.
23:55
And you know, they showed a brilliant
23:56
like science park graphic where they
23:59
show like two like nebulous molecules
24:03
kind of merging one.
24:05
>> And I I felt like, you know, there's
24:06
that clip from Starship Troopers where
24:08
there's the kid that says, "I'm doing my
24:10
part." And I kind of thought this was
24:12
like Apple like wanting to make out like
24:14
and we're using our models, too. It's
24:15
not just the Google Gemini models. And I
24:19
But are you Apple? Are you is it did you
24:21
really merge it and was it you merged it
24:23
in terms of you used your logo and
24:26
Google's model or
24:27
>> Well, I I I think I think they've been
24:29
at pains to say I think uh Greg Josia
24:31
came out and in an interview and said
24:33
that was at pains to emphasize that no
24:36
they're not using Gemini they're using
24:39
Apple models based on Gemini or you know
24:42
they so they took um you know they're
24:46
entirely Apple. Not it's not using
24:48
Gemini, you know, he's denied that said
24:50
that quite explicitly. No, it's not
24:51
Gemini. These are Apple Foundation
24:53
models.
24:54
>> Well, I thought talking about the client
24:55
that like we built our own client, but I
24:57
thought the underlying model was but I
24:59
might have got that wrong.
25:00
>> Yeah. Isn't it like just like white
25:01
label Gemini? I mean it's got it's not
25:05
actually sending off to uh Google
25:07
servers to do the request but Gemini
25:09
running on Apple servers
25:10
>> except for when it is using Google
25:12
servers but it's running private cloud
25:14
compute on Google's data center
25:15
infrastructure
25:16
>> which they you know you can you can
25:18
verify they say well it's private cloud
25:20
compute so it's open
25:21
>> at least everyone in the EU has exactly
25:23
the same uh model of Apple intelligence
25:26
>> that that's one of the models they have
25:28
a special European model
25:30
>> but
25:32
Let's actually that's a good segue.
25:33
Let's talk about that. You know that
25:35
this unfortunately Siri AI isn't coming
25:37
to the EU and and Charlie do you want to
25:39
explain why that is?
25:40
>> Yeah. So, uh yeah, not coming to the EU
25:43
in which includes access to the new Siri
25:45
app, upgraded visual intelligence in
25:48
integrated writing tools and well the
25:50
new stuff. Uh Apple says that the EU's
25:53
well yeah so this is a another fight
25:56
between Apple and the EU with Apple
25:58
saying one thing uh trying to spin it
26:00
like the big evil EU is stopping it from
26:02
bringing Apple intelligence to over here
26:04
whereas that appears to be not the case
26:06
at all. So Apple says the EU's digital
26:08
markets act would require it to give
26:10
third party AI assistance direct access
26:12
to the user data and system features
26:14
which they say would create serious
26:16
privacy and security risks even though
26:19
we can already do that on the Mac. So,
26:21
you know, and we'll be able to do that
26:22
on the Mac. So, this is just iOS
26:24
devices.
26:25
>> Oh, they're okay with serious privacy
26:27
and security risks on the Mac.
26:28
>> Exactly. Um, to alleviate those privacy
26:32
and security concerns, Apple says it's
26:34
designed a trusted system agent, it
26:36
calls it, or TSA, which is another
26:39
another
26:40
>> good acronym that that instills
26:42
confidence in security.
26:43
>> Exactly. [laughter] And that's it. and
26:46
they've uh this will allow other virtual
26:49
assistants access to the same features
26:51
as Siri. Um the EU the eur the European
26:54
European Commission has rejected these
26:56
solutions. Apple says um submitted plans
26:59
for this and said we're going to need 18
27:00
months to actually build it, but they
27:02
actually also said that they're not
27:04
working on it at the moment. They've got
27:05
zero engineers working on it at the
27:06
moment. So pretty much what they've said
27:08
is they've come up with a these new
27:11
features. Knowing the DMA was not going
27:14
to well may or may not let them use them
27:16
in the EU. They said to the EU just uh
27:22
let us have an exemption. Just let us
27:23
launch it without and uh you know a year
27:27
and a half pinky promise.
27:29
>> Yeah. Now it's important that this the
27:31
the digital markets act is uh
27:33
specifically about business and
27:35
competition.
27:37
not about um security and privacy. So,
27:40
this is uh if Apple gives itself access
27:44
to all of the stuff on your your iPhone
27:46
in order to run a digital assistant, the
27:48
new Siri, uh it also has to give that to
27:53
um to rivals. Apple's not using its
27:55
position uh to give it an advantage. if
27:59
it was to get this uh 18 months to just
28:02
run this thing and you know in 18 months
28:04
time Apple's could always say oh yeah we
28:06
haven't finished it yet uh you know that
28:08
gives them a an 18-month head start
28:10
nobody else has to have access to it and
28:12
it goes back and forth well I don't know
28:14
what what what do we think of that
28:15
Graeme what do you uh what do you think
28:17
about that being a fellow European and
28:20
uh but also Apple bigger Apple fan than
28:22
me
28:23
>> well I I'm obviously disappointed that
28:25
uh I may or may not be able to get
28:27
access to these It is worth saying that
28:29
the way that the DMA works in the EU is
28:33
there's only two Apple platforms that
28:34
are covered by it because they are
28:36
gateway devices, which is the iPhone and
28:39
the iPad. Um, so this we're only here
28:41
talking about the iPhone and the iPad.
28:43
This doesn't affect any of Apple's other
28:44
platforms, just those two.
28:46
Unfortunately, the iPhone is by far
28:47
[laughter] and away the most important
28:49
one. Um, which is why it's it's
28:51
considered a gateway platform. I don't
28:53
fully understand why the EU thinks the
28:55
iPad is a a gateway platform, but it
28:57
comes under this this rule as well.
28:59
>> I imagine just because it's the same
29:01
operating system as the iPhone.
29:03
>> Well, probably market share, right? I
29:04
mean, the tablets, there are no Android
29:07
tablets to speak of, right? It's
29:10
>> I don't know. I mean, my my brother's
29:12
kids have all got Android tablets. I
29:14
think people just buy them because
29:15
they're really cheap. You know, you want
29:16
to stick uh something in the kitchen to
29:18
watch you Well, not me, but my brother
29:20
again to watch YouTube videos while
29:21
you're cooking. you know, you don't buy
29:23
an iPad. You just, you know, I see a lot
29:26
of junky cheap Android tablets running
29:29
Android phone apps.
29:31
>> But yeah, I mean, you you could also be
29:32
right. It's just I I you know, I see a
29:35
lot of bad Android tablets like out and
29:37
about.
29:39
>> My take is I don't think there's a
29:40
problem here. I think uh everything's
29:42
working the way that it should. If you
29:44
look at the way that um Apple develops
29:46
new features, um this is a really
29:48
consistent pattern. You see it
29:50
absolutely with the health stuff um and
29:53
fitness uh that they they develop a new
29:55
thing and initially they just do it
29:57
themselves and then once they've got it
29:59
working pretty well then they create a
30:01
framework that they extend to third
30:02
party developers. So, you know, as
30:05
someone that's been working on fitness
30:07
apps, I've seen this time and again and
30:09
you know if Apple introduces something
30:10
to the workout app one year, then you
30:13
know a year or two later they will
30:15
probably enable you to add that feature
30:17
to your app as well. And that's just how
30:19
Apple works. And I think it's it's in
30:22
the nature of software development that
30:23
it does work that way because to create
30:25
a stable third party API, you really
30:29
need to work out how that should work
30:31
first. And you do that with a first
30:33
party solution to begin with. So I don't
30:36
think it's wrong that Apple developed
30:38
this for themselves and wants to ship
30:41
it. Now, Apple, one should say, has been
30:44
under a certain degree of pressure to
30:46
get its act together on its AI solution.
30:50
So, if I was the boss of Apple and it's
30:52
like, shall we ship this now where it's
30:54
legal or should we wait another 18
30:56
months so that we can concurrently ship
30:58
it in the EU and the US? And my reaction
31:01
would be, no, I'm going to ship it now
31:02
in the US where it's legal and then, you
31:05
know, we we'll work on the the third
31:08
party frameworks and ship it in the EU.
31:11
in due course and the EU legislation
31:15
exists to to create a competitive
31:18
marketplace and that's uh you know the
31:20
EU is a democratic institution that's
31:21
what EU governments have decided that
31:23
they want and I think that's fair enough
31:25
it it it the consequence is that they
31:28
have to wait longer for it or we have to
31:30
wait longer for it but that's just both
31:32
sides doing what they're they're
31:34
supposed to do it wouldn't have made any
31:35
sense for Apple to wait another 18
31:37
months just wouldn't have made sense
31:39
they have to ship this now. And equally,
31:41
I agree with what you're saying,
31:43
Charlie, that there's no reason why the
31:44
EU should give them an 18-month head
31:46
start either. So, I think everyone has
31:48
made the correct decisions in the
31:50
circumstances, and this is just the way
31:52
it is. I don't think we're going to end
31:54
up with uh with a if they go ahead with
31:57
this with this TSA thing uh this in
31:59
between layer that is supposed which
32:02
essentially I guess means that any AI
32:05
chatbot or whatever the third party one
32:07
will have to query Apple's one and get
32:09
the answers from that and then send them
32:10
back. I'm not sure how well I'm sure
32:12
it's more complicated than that but
32:13
we've got precedent for when Apple
32:15
sticks a little layer in between and
32:16
that is um browser engine kit. You are
32:19
you familiar with this? This is um
32:22
Apple's way of allowing Okay, so the uh
32:25
the EU told them you've got to put third
32:28
party browsers on on the iPad. So Apple
32:30
said, "Okay, we'll do it, but you've got
32:31
to use web, you know, you got to use
32:33
WebKit." And so really these are just
32:35
skins around WebKit. Uh you can
32:38
synchronize your your bookmarks and
32:41
things like that and your login Chrome,
32:44
but other than that, it's you know, it's
32:45
pretty much just Safari.
32:47
Um so they have I can't remember when it
32:50
was like the year before last when they
32:52
actually made it possible for you to run
32:54
uh third party um rendering engines on
32:58
on iOS only in the EU I think or or in
33:01
other you know territories which force
33:03
them to do it um but no one's done it
33:06
because it's been such Apple made it so
33:08
difficult to do and they came up with a
33:10
thing called browser engine kit which is
33:14
I won't go into it now but it's an
33:15
intermediary layer that sounds like it's
33:17
going to, you know, sim similar in
33:19
principle to the TSA thing. I'm enjoying
33:22
calling it TSA.
33:24
Uh, and it's terrible. I mean, that's
33:27
one of the reasons why because Apple
33:29
doesn't use it. So, if they're not using
33:31
it, then they just, you know, they don't
33:33
care about updating it, making it good.
33:35
>> Same thing with the the alternative app
33:36
marketplaces. Apple made the rules so
33:39
Byzantine and complicated and you still
33:42
have to pay them certain amounts of
33:43
money, but it's a bizarre payment
33:46
structure and system that nobody's
33:48
bothered doing it.
33:50
>> And Apple's argument that privacy is
33:52
behind this, that it doesn't want to
33:53
give uh other people other And now I I
33:56
don't want um you know other uh AI who
34:00
was it like Open AI or anybody like
34:01
that. I don't want them having access to
34:02
all the stuff on my phone. Of course
34:03
not. I mean like I I don't use WhatsApp
34:05
or didn't until quite recently because
34:08
it it takes your it requires that you
34:10
give access to your address book and you
34:12
know that's not my data that's all data
34:14
of other people that's just happens to
34:15
be on my phone so I don't want that but
34:17
I don't think this is I don't know Apple
34:21
always says privacy privacy when it
34:23
doesn't want to do something uh but the
34:25
thing is you've got to trust Apple on
34:26
this and they have got like we said how
34:28
many different models are there for of
34:30
of intelligence like where is it where
34:32
is this this query when I ask, "Well, is
34:34
it on my phone? Is it not on my phone?
34:36
Is it in Google's data centers? Is it in
34:37
private cloud compute? Is it one of the
34:39
ones that gets booted off to chat GPT?"
34:41
No one's going to I mean, we don't know
34:42
that. And we're like super nerds who who
34:44
write about this stuff. So, regular
34:46
users not going to know that. And, you
34:49
know, the idea that Apple is completely
34:52
trustworthy
34:53
maybe. I mean, it's the operating system
34:56
vendor, so you got to trust them to a
34:57
certain extent, but uh Google is also an
35:00
operating system vendor, and I don't
35:01
trust Android or Chrome. I know there's
35:04
a feature somewhere in settings where
35:05
you can bring up a report and see how
35:08
many of your queries have been processed
35:11
on device and how many have gone to
35:13
private cloud compute. And I imagine
35:15
this might break it down even further,
35:17
but um I mean, again, my job is to know
35:20
everything and I can't find where it is
35:22
in settings.
35:23
>> [laughter]
35:24
>> I mean they Apple does say that they
35:26
they make this private cloud compute
35:28
solution available to third party
35:30
experts to to check that it it's it's
35:33
legit. I mean I'm not the kind of expert
35:36
who would be capable of checking that
35:38
it's legit but you know
35:40
>> the idea is there that they they can
35:42
anybody any security researcher can
35:44
download the exact same software that
35:46
powers private cloud compute on their
35:49
own computer and do security research on
35:51
it. Correct. I mean, I don't doubt that
35:53
Apple's stuff is
35:54
>> is is priv, you know, privacy focused
35:56
and is probably as watertight as it can
35:58
get. Probably this stuff's great because
36:00
that is something they're really good at
36:01
and they take it seriously.
36:02
>> But at the same time, I don't know the
36:04
amount that they are using, you know,
36:07
that the iOS to iOS to serve ads now.
36:09
You know, you see ads for for Apple
36:11
products in the settings in the app
36:12
store and it's a slippery slope. I guess
36:15
I I don't you know, solve this because
36:19
they kind of have to. the EU is a big
36:21
enough market that they they will have
36:24
to find some solution. But I guess one
36:26
of the things that they'll be looking at
36:27
really carefully is what impact the
36:30
absence of these features has on sales
36:32
of, you know, when the new iPhone comes
36:35
out, does that impact sales in the EU?
36:38
Because that ultimately Apple's a
36:39
business and the bottom line will be
36:41
whether or not it's really a priority to
36:43
ship some kind of EU compliance solution
36:46
for Apple will come down to are people
36:48
in the EU still buying iPhones or not?
36:51
And you know, if people vote with their
36:53
with their wallets in in the fall and
36:56
decide not to buy the new iPhone because
36:59
in in the EU because it doesn't have
37:01
Siri, that would certainly be sending
37:03
Coutino a strong signal and then I think
37:05
they they would prioritize a compliance
37:07
solution. But if they actually have a
37:09
bumper, you know, a bumper round of
37:11
iPhone sales in the EU, then it's not
37:14
going to be a top priority for them.
37:15
It's it's interesting because when
37:17
there's a feature that's region locked
37:18
that Apple doesn't want to implement
37:20
like alternative app marketplaces, then
37:22
they really lock it down. Like if you're
37:24
in the United States or outside Europe
37:26
for more than 30 days, then the apps
37:29
that you've installed using alternative
37:30
marketplaces like shut down and they
37:32
won't launch. However, the previous
37:35
Apple Intelligence features before they
37:37
were enabled in the EU were still in
37:39
there and you could still enable it. All
37:40
you had to do was go into settings,
37:42
general, language, and region, and set
37:44
your region to a non-EU country. And
37:46
presumably that's still the case. I
37:49
assume I I guess if any listeners in a
37:52
European country would like to test that
37:54
for me and verify, uh, that that'd be
37:56
good to know, but I assume that's still
37:58
the case, but obviously Apple can't
38:00
advertise it because that's not supposed
38:02
to be an official feature.
38:04
>> I think they're going to just do what
38:07
they have to do. I think that all they
38:08
all of this uh nonsense that we're
38:11
talking about now is just Apple using
38:14
one of its biggest platforms to you know
38:16
it's WD the WWDC announcement to try and
38:20
blame things on the EU. I think it's
38:21
just leverage. I think that they're
38:23
going to just do what they're told
38:24
eventually and it's going to be
38:26
grudgingly as ever.
38:27
>> I'm I'm curious about how do you guys
38:28
feel about the DMA in general? You know
38:30
that does this
38:32
>> I love it
38:32
>> for it or against it for
38:34
>> government overreach or
38:35
>> No, it's not a government overreach.
38:36
It's just uh tech is so underregulated.
38:40
It needs something. Everything else is
38:42
regulated. We don't complain. We don't
38:43
say that um automobile industry is
38:45
suffering from government overreach
38:47
because we have to wear seat belts or we
38:48
have to drive, you know, under a certain
38:51
speed when we're in in town.
38:52
>> Some people are saying this country
38:54
unfortunately. [laughter]
38:55
>> Well, yeah. Although
38:56
>> there's lots of lots of people in this
38:58
country uh hate seat belt laws. Oh my
39:01
god.
39:01
>> Yeah. But you know
39:03
>> laws.
39:04
>> Yeah. Well, that's true. Not really an
39:07
obvious though. I mean, this is like
39:09
saying, "Oh, uh, Fiat sells the most
39:11
cars and but you also have to be able to
39:13
put in like a Buick engine."
39:15
>> Well, no, because they're not saying
39:16
that you need to be able to put an Intel
39:17
chip in your Mac. This is
39:19
>> Yeah, but they're saying you have I
39:20
mean, the software and stuff is like I
39:23
don't know. I I find this whole I If I
39:25
lived there, I'd be furious about it.
39:26
Every time I hear it, I go, "Geeesh,
39:28
what's what's wrong?"
39:29
>> Okay. Okay. Wait, wait, wait, [laughter]
39:31
>> Lewis.
39:32
>> Yeah.
39:32
>> You also really don't like Siri. you
39:34
haven't liked Siri before, you know,
39:36
last week. If you
39:39
point to what?
39:40
>> You're denying yourself the you're
39:42
you're denying yourself the ability to
39:44
install something that's better. Like if
39:46
you had the ability to use chat GPT as
39:48
your voice assistant this whole time,
39:49
you know, due to a regulation, you'd be
39:51
thankful for it.
39:52
>> Yeah, I could buy an Android phone if I
39:54
wanted.
39:55
>> I like Graeme's um point that he's like
39:58
your or your fantasy that uh people are
40:00
going to not buy iPhones because they
40:02
don't have Siri. Oh, we we we can't get
40:04
the new Siri, so we're going to flip to
40:05
Android. It's like when was Siri ever I
40:08
mean ever a reason to buy an iPhone?
40:09
It's a reason not to buy an iPhone.
40:11
>> I was I was only saying that that's
40:13
something that Cupina will be looking at
40:14
closely.
40:15
>> No, I know. I know. I wasn't.
40:17
>> Well, they they did um a couple of years
40:19
ago, you know, whatever it was, the
40:21
iPhone 16 or the 15, it was a I mean uh
40:25
I remember in one of the conference
40:26
calls uh they said that it sold
40:28
initially because of the promises of
40:30
Apple intelligence. And this is one of
40:32
the reasons why they got sued, wasn't
40:33
it? Um
40:34
>> yeah,
40:34
>> because they they didn't deliver on this
40:36
this promised feature. I mean, the
40:38
hardware was sold on these coming on
40:41
these features that they never
40:42
delivered. Uh but I remember them citing
40:44
that saying that they had a super cycle
40:47
and it was because of these Apple
40:48
intelligence features that were
40:50
promised. So I I don't think it's, you
40:52
know, I think Graeme, you have a good
40:53
point. I think um it is possibly it's
40:56
definitely a selling point, you know,
40:57
and um I mean for you for sure, right? I
41:00
mean, you're definitely thinking about
41:02
these things. I'm sure most most of the,
41:04
you know, the majority of Apple
41:06
customers will take it into
41:08
consideration for sure.
41:09
>> It will be a factor. And I think um you
41:14
know if you look at it the other way
41:15
round if if it was uh if Apple was a
41:18
European company and then they were
41:20
saying oh they were picking a fight with
41:22
the US government and refusing to ship
41:24
some features in the US then there would
41:27
be lots of American customers that would
41:29
not feel so great about that company as
41:30
a result. And so it is going to affect
41:34
consumer sentiment in in the EU for
41:36
sure. I I think the DMA personally is is
41:40
trying to do the right thing and I think
41:42
there's a couple of reasons why it's
41:43
it's not necessarily succeeding. I have
41:46
a lot of sympathy for what Lewis is
41:47
saying about whether it's right for
41:49
lawmakers to to design our devices for
41:52
us. That doesn't seem to be quite the
41:54
right approach. Um I think there's
41:56
another problem that these this
41:58
legislation is all about competition. So
42:00
it's about protecting the interests of
42:01
big business. It's not about the
42:03
interests of protecting consumers. So it
42:05
it's looking after the big guy, not the
42:07
little guy. So I'm not so keen on in it
42:09
for that respect. The the third concern
42:12
that I have about this is ultimately it
42:14
doesn't work because even though the EU
42:16
is is massive, it's one of the world's
42:18
largest single markets. Um it's not big
42:21
enough to really affect change. I think
42:22
that that is one of the biggest issues
42:24
with stuff like app marketplaces. If
42:26
Apple introduces a feature and region
42:28
locks it to the EU, there's no
42:31
justification in investing in building
42:33
that feature. So take for example if
42:36
Apple introduces a compliance solution
42:39
for third party AI assistance on iPhone
42:42
which they probably will and probably no
42:44
one will use it and that might be for
42:47
the reason that Charlie stated that it
42:49
it might be really difficult thing to
42:51
use but I think it would also be if you
42:53
are chat GBT or or anthropic are you
42:57
going to invest a lot of time in
42:58
building a product that you can only
43:00
sell in the EU and probably not. I hope
43:03
in happier times in the future, the EU
43:07
and the US and maybe other, you know, we
43:11
can have a more of an international
43:14
approach to this in terms of working out
43:16
what we think is important to protect
43:18
consumers first and big business second
43:21
and have a coordinated industrial policy
43:24
that that puts consumer interests first
43:26
and still to a reasonable extent allows
43:30
companies like Apple to innovate whilst
43:32
at at the same time protecting
43:35
competitive markets.
43:37
>> Yeah. Okay. Let's I got a question here
43:39
from uh from a a listener called Brad
43:41
Brad Thornber uh who who asked via
43:43
Macedon. Uh Brad asked will OS27 um or
43:47
any all of Apple's platforms include a
43:50
no AI please button in settings or
43:53
perhaps an iCloud setting to disable AI
43:57
on all your devices. What do you think
43:58
about that? Do you think Apple's going
44:00
to do that? In the previous version of
44:02
Apple Intelligence, you could go to the
44:04
Apple Intelligence in Siri settings and
44:06
there was a toggle switch at the top
44:07
where you could just turn it off
44:08
entirely. That was the case in iOS 18
44:10
and 26. In iOS 27, that switch is gone.
44:14
So, as far as I know, all of the Apple
44:15
Intelligence settings are just enabled
44:17
for everybody and you can't turn them
44:18
off. At the bottom of that settings
44:21
panel, there's a big red button that
44:23
says uh oh, let me let me bring it up
44:25
here. That just says turn Siri off. Um,
44:29
and I don't know what that button does.
44:32
Uh,
44:33
>> I I can I can hazard a guess.
44:35
>> Yeah. Yeah. Well, but well, like
44:37
[laughter] have they just renamed the
44:38
button like to that disables the new
44:41
Siri and you still get old Siri? Does
44:43
that exclusively turn off Siri but then
44:45
none of the other Apple Intelligence
44:47
features? It's It's a little vague. I
44:49
mean, and I have to keep it enabled to,
44:50
you know, do my job and talk about the
44:52
new Siri. But, um, no. I guess the
44:55
answer is no. There will not be a no AI
44:57
button anymore. If you upgrade to 27,
45:00
you're stuck with it.
45:01
>> Maybe maybe they'll add it. Or or else
45:02
you could just go in and say you live in
45:04
the EU or something. That wouldn't be
45:05
everything, would it?
45:07
>> Then you'd also lose Well, there's a lot
45:08
of US features that aren't in the EU.
45:10
Like you would lose access to your Apple
45:11
Card if you have an Apple Card. A bunch
45:13
of other US exclusive features.
45:16
>> It's kind of weird if if they I I didn't
45:19
realize there was a turn it off button
45:21
in iOS 26. I mean, I remember that you
45:24
had to go in initially and like get on a
45:27
wait list to to try these things, right?
45:29
Just like with Siri, but I don't
45:31
remember.
45:32
>> And then after it launched, every time
45:33
it set up, it prompted you to turn them
45:35
on and you
45:36
>> I didn't remember that.
45:37
>> There was tiny text at the bottom where
45:38
you could say no or set up later or skip
45:40
and it would leave that setting turned
45:42
off. But yeah, it it's enabled by
45:45
default.
45:45
>> Yeah. So, there you have it, Brad. Your
45:47
So, I'm afraid.
45:49
>> Mhm. Griffin, let's talk about 15 great
45:52
new Apple intelligence to feature uh to
45:54
try out beyond Siri AI.
45:57
>> Yeah. So, this is obviously a gigantic
45:59
portion of the keynote. I guess we
46:01
should talk about the the the ke the
46:03
framing of the keynote itself for for a
46:05
brief moment. Um how it's always worked
46:07
in the past uh and how he's how we've
46:09
always covered it is that they Apple
46:11
talks about all of the new features
46:13
platform by platform like you know
46:15
vision OS we'll do the vision OS section
46:17
iPad OS we'll do the iPad OS section.
46:19
Mac OS. We'll do the Mac OS section. And
46:21
in the last few years, there's been like
46:23
a little bit of bleed over like, oh,
46:24
we'll talk about this feature later in
46:26
the keynote in the iPad section, but
46:28
it's coming to the Mac 2 or other stuff
46:31
like that. This they completely threw
46:33
their normal format out the window. The
46:35
first section was, oh yeah, we we we did
46:38
a lot of little new things and features,
46:40
but we're not going to talk about them,
46:42
but a lot of little things are just
46:43
generally better. And then that was like
46:45
10 minutes. Uh then the next section was
46:47
the the platform safety section which I
46:49
think uh everybody used as like a little
46:51
coffee break and then there was the
46:52
actual intelligence section. Um and at
46:56
Colton Mac at least my my assignment was
46:58
to write up vision OS and there were
47:01
like two moments in the keynote where
47:02
they they briefly mentioned a vision OS
47:04
featured in passing. It's like oh okay
47:06
I'll I'll I'll add that sentence to my
47:09
article. Uh, and then they get to the
47:11
end and it's like, okay, the keynote's
47:13
just over and they haven't talked about
47:15
any of the platforms and like we were
47:17
like melting down in Slack. Like, what
47:19
are we going to do? We we we're all
47:21
sitting here with our our our prewrites
47:23
open and we don't what do we what do we
47:26
write in there? Um, so
47:30
I guess I just wanted to share that with
47:32
the audience. It it was a weird keynote.
47:34
Um,
47:36
>> okay.
47:36
>> All right. Back to what? Back to the
47:38
back to what we asked originally. 15
47:40
great new Apple intelligence features to
47:41
ask. [laughter]
47:42
May
47:42
>> that's true.
47:43
>> May maybe you better keep it to uh just
47:45
a few cuz
47:47
>> so there's more than just the new Siri.
47:49
There's the the photos uh clean up
47:52
editing features. So these are extend
47:55
and refframe uh and and the general
47:58
cleanup feature just got a little better
48:00
with their new their image model. Now
48:01
you can uncrop a photo and you know if
48:04
you zoom out you'll see like your photo
48:06
in the middle and it'll be blurry around
48:07
the edges and then you you get it to
48:09
where you think it wants to be and then
48:10
it'll pause for like 20 seconds and fill
48:13
it in. There's refframe where you can
48:16
change the perspective of the image like
48:18
you can if we take your group photo but
48:20
you know it's just in front of a parking
48:22
lot and it's kind of ugly. Well, you can
48:24
change the angle of the photo and make
48:26
it more centered and it'll it'll fill in
48:28
the background. Just quickly on that,
48:29
have you seen what it does to
48:30
backgrounds with text in them?
48:32
>> Yes. It's It's not pleasant. It It It's
48:35
not good at generating text at all.
48:37
>> I love the way they frame that where
48:39
they said, "We respect the integrity of
48:42
a real original photo." And [laughter]
48:46
now look at all this.
48:47
>> And they said that right after talking
48:49
about image playground and right before
48:51
talking about this. So [laughter]
48:53
yeah, it's
48:54
>> Well, one of our writers, Ed Ed, tried
48:56
it out. the um the the uh uh what do you
48:59
call it?
48:59
>> Enhance or extend extend
49:03
extend. And the results look great. It
49:06
looked really remarkable, but it added a
49:08
whole bunch of stuff that wasn't there.
49:10
[laughter] Uh doors that don't exist and
49:12
a balcony that doesn't doesn't exist.
49:14
And you know, when I looked at this, I'm
49:16
like, is that a Yeah, it's not a
49:18
photograph anymore, is it really?
49:20
>> Mhm. I'm not sure that people really
49:21
want to change the perspective of a
49:22
photo, but I could imagine, you know, if
49:24
you've got something off center and you
49:26
just want you just need a bit more image
49:28
on the left, I could imagine people
49:29
might use that. Well, actually, I
49:31
thought the reframing thing looked kind
49:32
of useful, you know, like the one that
49:34
the examples I've seen um it kind of
49:37
works pretty great, you know, like uh
49:38
because sometimes you have something,
49:40
you know, you're trying to take a person
49:41
a picture of a person and then they have
49:43
something weird behind their head and it
49:45
it ruins the whole composition. So then
49:47
you just shift it a little bit and that
49:49
the of course the examples I'm seeing
49:50
are curated. You know there are people
49:52
who when it's worked well and they're
49:54
proud of it and they want to put it up
49:56
on social media and so you know all the
49:57
examples so far I've seen it looks great
50:00
and that's the kind of thing that you
50:01
know like when I'm trying to take a
50:02
picture I I usually try to be kind of
50:04
careful about the framing of it. Mhm.
50:06
>> Um but so it is, you know, like it it
50:09
it's that one that one seemed to be seem
50:11
to be less problematic to me than the
50:14
extend one where it's purely adding
50:16
stuff that is completely hallucinated.
50:18
>> Well, I was thinking like a good a
50:20
potential use case for this is if you're
50:22
at a concert or a stage and you and
50:24
you're like taking a picture of
50:25
somebody, but you're like way lower than
50:27
them would normally take a picture. And
50:29
I actually had an example of this in my
50:30
photo library uh where I went to a uh
50:34
drag show bingo and one of my friends
50:36
won one of the rounds of bingo. And so
50:38
they they got up on stage and they were
50:39
you know they had won like a special
50:41
basket that had been made and so they're
50:43
it was on a stage. So obviously I'm
50:45
taking the picture like really far down
50:47
low. And so I tried reframing it and uh
50:50
you know the the people look mostly okay
50:53
but it completely butchers the text
50:55
behind them because it doesn't know
50:57
what's written there on in giant letters
51:00
on the stage. And it's
51:02
>> image playground its visual quality is
51:05
kind of in the same vein where it's it
51:08
feels like it's an image model from two
51:11
years ago and image models two years ago
51:14
they couldn't generate text at all. And
51:16
that's that's the case with this this
51:17
too. It it might I know that it's
51:20
supposed to say, you know, bingo behind
51:22
there, but it doesn't know that that's
51:23
the letter B. So, it just throws up
51:25
something else and it just it works
51:27
great if there's no text to be found.
51:29
And also if you're in a location that
51:31
you're not familiar with. So, it's okay
51:32
if it makes something up and it doesn't
51:34
bother you. What kind of surprised me is
51:36
that Apple didn't have any sort of story
51:38
where oh, we embed any AI pictures that
51:41
use these tools with like special
51:42
metadata to indicate that it's an AI
51:44
photo that you can't remove. They they
51:46
didn't have any story there whatsoever,
51:47
which surprised me.
51:49
>> Is that true? I I read something about
51:52
But maybe that was only things in image
51:53
playground, but they're talking about
51:55
putting some kind of tag in there. I
51:57
mean, there's digital watermarks, but I
51:59
I think, you know, any kid could just
52:01
take a a screenshot of of the image
52:04
anyway, and that that that screenshot
52:06
won't have the metadata in it. So, I I
52:09
think it it's like I think that's a
52:10
great idea, but in practice, I don't
52:12
think it um you know, if someone wanted
52:14
to maliciously use these tools, there's
52:16
no way of stopping it really.
52:18
>> Maliciously using it to put extra doors
52:19
in your Airbnb. [laughter]
52:21
>> Yeah.
52:24
I I bet there's going to be a whole
52:26
genre on the Apple bloggerosphere of
52:29
posts of all the funny things that these
52:31
tools do. And I'm very here for it. I
52:33
hope that Cultmac does one. I will read
52:35
it.
52:36
>> Next up, we have um this is an
52:39
interesting feature. Passwords can fix
52:41
weak credentials automatically. The
52:44
Apple Passwords app uh has a access to
52:48
like a Safari browsing agent that can
52:51
update and save your passwords for you.
52:54
So, if you have a bunch of old passwords
52:55
that you've reused over the years, I
52:57
mean, I I always tell my friends, you
52:58
know, hey, look at the warning section
52:59
in Apple Passwords and go through and
53:01
fix all those. That takes hours if you
53:03
have hundreds of passwords that you need
53:04
updated. You know, if you've been using
53:06
the same password for 20 years, then
53:08
that's like hundreds of sites. Uh
53:10
supposedly um with a single tap, Apple
53:12
intelligence navigates to the relevant
53:14
website, signs in, upgrades the account
53:16
to a strong password and saves that
53:18
password back into the passwords app
53:20
automatically. Um
53:22
>> that sounds very good.
53:23
>> I want to I want to try this.
53:24
>> Sounds great. I I saw some people
53:25
freaking out about this though already
53:27
on the socials who like, "Oh my god, I
53:28
don't want Apple I don't want, you know,
53:29
my iPhone changing my passes for me."
53:31
Unknown. Um although I think you have to
53:34
agree to each and every one, don't you?
53:35
Don't you? I saw something about saying
53:37
that you you have to actually
53:39
Um, you can't just say, "Okay, go ahead
53:42
and just change all my passwords." You
53:43
know, you have to agree to each one
53:46
individually,
53:47
>> probably just to just to verify that
53:48
it's actually worked. Um, I'd like to
53:50
try this out. I I haven't I haven't
53:52
fiddled with that yet.
53:53
>> I want to know if it
53:54
>> that sounds like a great feature.
53:55
>> Goes in and clicks the link in the
53:57
email,
53:58
>> responds to the text message, does all
54:00
those things. that it's it's such a
54:03
high-risk thing to get uh an AI agent to
54:06
do for you because if if they get it
54:08
wrong, you could be locked out of an
54:09
account and uh you know, so it feels
54:13
like going from not to 100 miles an hour
54:16
in a in a single it it's like Apple is
54:19
going from having no agentic solutions
54:21
for AI at all to proposing that we use
54:24
Siri to change automatically change
54:26
passwords on our accounts. Um I it's
54:30
like it is I think it's a great idea for
54:32
a product but it it uh does sound very
54:34
risky to me and I wouldn't it's
54:36
difficult to change passwords and that
54:38
that's in itself is a reason why I
54:40
wouldn't wouldn't trust Siri with it if
54:42
you don't trust Siri to tell you who won
54:44
the Super Bowl last year. Why would you
54:47
trust Siri with [laughter] 360,
54:51
you know? So, I I watch it with interest
54:53
because I agree it's a great idea for a
54:54
product. Um, and I might use it in two
54:57
years time, but I I'm not going to be
54:59
using it today.
55:01
>> Very reasonable. Uh, I was thinking of
55:03
you, Leander, when they brought up this
55:05
feature. Safari can automatically
55:07
organize your tabs. If you have dozens
55:10
or hundreds of tabs, it'll like group
55:12
them by topic and intelligently. And I
55:15
think it does that for bookmarks as
55:16
well. Uh there's a new feature where you
55:19
can have Safari notify you of any
55:21
changes on a website. If you like hit a
55:23
button there, it'll send you a
55:25
notification if like a page updates in
55:27
the background. Um as was rumored,
55:30
visual intelligence has moved into the
55:32
camera and gains new tricks like reading
55:34
nutrition labels, business cards,
55:37
splitting restaurant bills. It's a
55:39
little crowded in the uh in the new
55:41
camera app. Obviously, they redesigned
55:44
the camera app with the idea that you
55:45
would just have like, you know, the two
55:47
buttons there, photo and video, and
55:48
those would be the defaults, and you
55:50
know, like the user interface is like
55:51
perfectly sized for that. But now with
55:54
Siri in there as well, at least on like
55:56
the uh regular sized iPhone, it's
55:58
probably easier on the plus-siz phone,
56:00
but u they they don't quite have room
56:02
for all three. Like video is slightly
56:04
cut off, Siri is slightly cut off, but
56:06
you have photo in the middle. though
56:08
nowhere to be seen as the customizable
56:10
camera app as was heavily rumored by
56:12
Mark German. Um, not customizable at
56:15
all. So,
56:16
>> is that like his only miss?
56:19
>> No, he said that Mike Rockwell wouldn't
56:21
be in the keynote, didn't he? He said
56:23
that Mike Rockwell was going to be maybe
56:26
leaving Apple because he was excluded
56:27
from the keynote even though he was the
56:28
savior of Siri. Um,
56:31
>> I don't remember seeing that, but
56:33
>> I wouldn't be surprised if like
56:34
customizable cameras coming in like 0.1
56:36
or 2. Or maybe that's like a feature
56:39
that's supposed to be like one of the
56:41
main features of the new iPhones.
56:42
Sometimes they withhold like a software
56:44
feature for those. That's possible.
56:47
Messages and mail offer onetap
56:50
suggestions if somebody texts you about
56:51
an event. You know, currently it
56:53
underlines it and you can tap to add it
56:55
manually, but now it'll do more for you
56:57
and it'll basically add it on your
56:58
behalf. That's kind of handy.
57:00
Call context is an Apple intelligence
57:03
feature. So if you're calling, the
57:05
example they gave was an airline. If
57:07
you're calling an airline, it'll bring
57:08
up your flight information that it pulls
57:10
out of your email to show it in line in
57:12
the phone call. So you don't have to
57:14
like dig out of the phone call. I mean,
57:16
that'll be great if it works, but often
57:18
people book several flights at once. So
57:23
I hope it brings up the right one.
57:24
Otherwise, that'll just be annoying.
57:26
>> And so also people's birthdays, right?
57:27
If you call somebody up and it has their
57:29
birthday in in your contact in their
57:30
contact card, it'll remind you that it's
57:32
their birthday.
57:34
>> That's like a really nice feature.
57:35
>> That's that sounds handier because
57:36
whoever actually calls an airline.
57:40
[laughter]
57:41
>> Very frustrated people, I imagine.
57:44
>> Uh calendar lets you add an event using
57:48
plain language. So you can describe, you
57:50
know, for example, this is my English
57:53
class. It meets Monday, Wednesday,
57:55
Friday, every other week, you know, from
57:57
these hours or these hours. You know,
58:00
com rules that are able to set up in
58:02
calendar but are kind of fiddly and
58:04
complicated. Uh it can do that in plain
58:06
language allegedly. I'll I have yet to
58:09
test that out. I'll be interested. I'll
58:11
look up my old college schedule and see
58:12
how easy it is for me to recreate that.
58:15
Um a few smart home things. It no longer
58:18
floods you with notifications. it
58:20
combines them just into one if you
58:22
receive a series of notifications. I
58:24
hope there's an API for that because
58:25
that kind of bothers me about Snapchat
58:26
as well. Like it sends you a
58:27
notification if somebody starts typing a
58:29
message in a group and also when they
58:32
send the message and so it's if you've
58:34
got a busy group chat I mean it can
58:35
really quickly flood with a bunch of
58:37
notifications that are all kind of about
58:39
the same thing. Image playground does
58:41
photorealistic images as we mentioned.
58:44
You can now describe a shortcut and
58:46
it'll build it using natural language. I
58:48
think as was also rumored. I actually
58:49
tried this yesterday. I noticed in the
58:52
notes app there's a new feature where
58:54
you can copy the text of a note in
58:56
markdown format. And I thought, "Oh,
58:58
that could be handy." Um, but usually
59:00
what I want is I want to start with a
59:02
note and then get it to HTML so that I
59:04
can paste it in WordPress as an article.
59:07
You know, if I'm drafting something in
59:08
notes, then I want to be able to like
59:09
paste it in WordPress really quickly. So
59:11
I asked it, okay, build a shortcut that
59:14
looks at the clipboard and if the
59:16
clipboard is full of markdown, then
59:19
convert it to HTML and add it back to
59:21
the clipboard. And yeah,
59:24
>> it did work. It worked really well.
59:26
>> No way. Really?
59:26
>> That's encouraging.
59:28
>> It only took like three or four actions
59:31
in in as a shortcut. So I guess it was
59:34
probably an easier task than I imagined
59:36
it being, but um yeah, worked pretty
59:38
well. So, I think I'll probably share
59:40
that with the rest of our writing staff.
59:41
>> That sounds really they're really
59:43
useful.
59:44
>> Apparently, they've added new steps, new
59:45
chunks to um shortcuts because of this.
59:48
>> Yeah. Now, now it does if else
59:50
statements, which is like a logical
59:52
thing that's been missing for a really
59:53
long time.
59:54
>> Yeah. Which is handy for everyone. I
59:57
really like that.
59:57
>> There there's a few more. I'll we'll
59:59
link to this in the show notes. Uh those
1:00:01
are the highlights of of the best Apple
1:00:04
intelligence features.
1:00:05
>> Bunch of cool features, I think. Yeah.
1:00:07
bunch of a lot of that stuff looks
1:00:08
really useful, really helpful. I I notic
1:00:10
in messages, you know, someone was I was
1:00:12
talking about meeting up someone later
1:00:13
and there's now a very distinct button
1:00:15
where it says, you know, add this to
1:00:17
your calendar and you click it and it
1:00:19
it's added. It's great. Um the trouble
1:00:22
is calendar most of the time I spend is
1:00:23
like tweaking the notifications.
1:00:26
Uh you know, remind me one day before,
1:00:29
remind me three days before, remind me
1:00:30
seven 30 minutes before, two hours
1:00:32
before, three hours before, that kind of
1:00:33
stuff. That's what I spend most of my
1:00:34
time doing is adding a bunch of those so
1:00:36
I don't forget things.
1:00:37
>> You need to add a bunch of notifications
1:00:38
for the podcast. [laughter]
1:00:40
>> Yeah. Then well then then I Exactly.
1:00:43
Then I forget.
1:00:45
>> And you schedule a meeting on top of the
1:00:46
podcast.
1:00:48
>> Yeah. Yeah, I know. Um let's not get
1:00:50
into that. [laughter]
1:00:52
[snorts]
1:00:53
>> Let's talk about Mac OS a little bit.
1:00:55
>> Okay. Mac OS Golden Gate. Yay. Hometown.
1:00:57
Love it. [laughter] I was surprised by
1:00:59
that. I was surprised by Golden Gate.
1:01:02
That's good. Uh,
1:01:04
>> wait, wait, let me re derail you just uh
1:01:06
30 seconds into this segment. Um, the
1:01:08
sort of like hero color of all the
1:01:10
operating systems this year, like the
1:01:11
wallpaper that they push as the default,
1:01:13
the default color scheme uh last year
1:01:16
was blue. This year it's brown.
1:01:19
So like their their 27 graphic on on on
1:01:21
the keynote was like 27 over like these
1:01:24
brown waves and that's like the default
1:01:26
wallpaper now. Uh how do we feel about
1:01:29
that?
1:01:30
>> Well, it's like uh like having the zoom
1:01:31
back.
1:01:32
>> [snorts]
1:01:33
>> It's kind of uh bronze, isn't it? Um
1:01:37
Yeah, I guess it's brown brownish.
1:01:39
>> You'd think that if the the name was
1:01:41
Golden Gate that it would be like orange
1:01:43
or international orange.
1:01:44
>> International orange. Yeah.
1:01:46
>> Yeah.
1:01:47
>> Yeah. I don't know. I got to say it's
1:01:49
not the most vibrant color palette, but
1:01:51
uh what are you going to do?
1:01:52
>> I'll even say as a as an afficionado of
1:01:55
the color brown that it it's not a very
1:01:57
good shade of brown. [laughter] It's
1:01:58
kind of beige or tan. Um, I don't know.
1:02:02
Like the dark mode version is like all
1:02:04
purple and it's like a really rich deep
1:02:06
purple and it's quite pleasant. I'm
1:02:08
surprised they didn't just go with that.
1:02:11
>> But uh anyways, brown.
1:02:14
>> Okay,
1:02:14
>> carry on. [snorts]
1:02:15
>> Well, it's kind of golden.
1:02:17
Dust dusty gold. It's what's uh what is
1:02:21
the color that they always have? I can't
1:02:23
even remember all of a sudden. Rose
1:02:25
gold. It's kind of rose goldy.
1:02:29
Anyway, so the good news is, I mean,
1:02:30
aside from the fantastic name, they've
1:02:33
uh they're improving the liquid glass
1:02:35
user interface and addressing many of
1:02:36
the frustrations and oddities that uh
1:02:40
came to plague Mac users with Mac OS
1:02:42
Tahoe. Uh so they've tweaked liquid
1:02:46
glass so the complex content behind it
1:02:47
is better diffused. Additionally, adding
1:02:49
a slider to let you adjust liquid glass
1:02:51
attended effect. They're doing this in
1:02:53
everything, right? I mean, u maybe not
1:02:55
Apple Watch, but iOS and iPad OS. Uh
1:03:00
revamp the Mac system icons so they
1:03:02
stand out even more and and uh so that
1:03:05
there won't be one with every single
1:03:07
item in a a menu. Uh oh, wait, that I
1:03:12
guess that's I think when the system
1:03:14
icons they were talking about. Uh
1:03:16
yeah, wait, it applies to both, right?
1:03:19
They also changed all the general app
1:03:22
icons, right? So, they gave them a more
1:03:24
snazzy liquid glass look.
1:03:26
>> Um,
1:03:26
>> they're sharper. They're they don't look
1:03:27
as blurry. It's It's really nice. I I'm
1:03:30
a really big fan of the icons. They
1:03:32
changed like the um the gradients as
1:03:34
well, so they're a little more subtle.
1:03:36
Like they used to have like the default
1:03:38
blue gradient. They would be like light
1:03:39
blue to dark blue, and now it's much
1:03:41
more solid and richer. I I'm a big fan
1:03:43
of the the new icons.
1:03:45
It was interesting watching the uh you
1:03:47
know when they talked about these things
1:03:49
and as as we predicted they were like oh
1:03:51
well
1:03:53
we're making it better. They're not
1:03:54
saying oh it was bad we're making it
1:03:57
better.
1:03:58
>> And uh it looks like they did make it
1:03:59
they got rid of some other problems that
1:04:01
drove some people crazy like the uh
1:04:04
corner radius of apps. I mean uh
1:04:07
>> or the windows. Yeah. That probably
1:04:08
drove you crazy, right?
1:04:10
>> Mhm.
1:04:10
>> I'm so blind I can't even tell. Uh, no.
1:04:13
>> I never noticed it once. [laughter]
1:04:16
>> Uh, yeah. So, consistent win window
1:04:18
corner radius across apps, colored side
1:04:20
by icons, icons in the active app. I
1:04:22
like that. So that you can tell which
1:04:24
app you're actually using if you got a
1:04:25
bunch of windows open. Uh, sidebar that
1:04:28
expands the Windows Edge and a unified
1:04:29
toolbar up at the top corner. So, uh,
1:04:31
all these things that seem to make the
1:04:34
Mac work better and more like a Mac,
1:04:38
less like a iPhone. Um they also said
1:04:41
that it's faster, you know, performance
1:04:44
improvements like faster app launches,
1:04:46
quicker airdrop transfers. Um as you
1:04:48
mentioned earlier, they totally rebuilt
1:04:51
Spotlight, the rebuilt the foundation of
1:04:53
Spotlight in Mac OS and iOS. Uh new
1:04:57
index architectures, faster, more
1:04:58
efficient, stable. Apple says faster
1:05:01
indexing, ensuring, get this, ensuring
1:05:03
you can find the right files almost
1:05:05
immediately. I mean, I'll just take it's
1:05:08
assuring you can find the right files
1:05:10
immediately. That's even better. Uh, new
1:05:12
architecture also power new search
1:05:14
experience in the mail app as we
1:05:15
discussed. Let's see. And all child
1:05:18
safety features. I mean, I don't know if
1:05:19
we want to discuss that stuff. It's kind
1:05:20
of interesting. You know, ask to browse
1:05:23
a specific website. Um,
1:05:25
>> did anyone pay attention to that part of
1:05:26
the keynote? I got to I went to get a
1:05:28
coffee and I totally tuned out.
1:05:29
>> You actually did. No, I I watched it.
1:05:31
Yeah. I mean, it's, you know, it's as
1:05:33
long as the kids don't figure out a way
1:05:34
to do it, you know, like saying, "Hey,
1:05:36
if you want to visit a website that we
1:05:37
haven't already pre-approved, you got to
1:05:39
ask mom and dad."
1:05:40
>> That's pretty severe. [clears throat]
1:05:42
>> Um, yeah,
1:05:43
>> time allowances and schedules.
1:05:46
>> Time allowances and schedules. Uh, like
1:05:48
for instance, you could say, "Oh, uh, I
1:05:51
only want you to be able to use
1:05:53
educational apps before school and
1:05:55
during school, but after school you can
1:05:57
go on to, you know, social media and
1:05:59
play games, whatever." So, I mean,
1:06:01
doesn't apply to me. My cat does not uh
1:06:03
use any of my devices, but uh it seems
1:06:06
like they were it seemed like they were
1:06:09
I think they could be useful. I mean, if
1:06:11
I was a parent and I had kids uh getting
1:06:14
online and stuff, I don't know. I I
1:06:15
think I'd be slightly terrified. It felt
1:06:17
a bit like they were trying to get ahead
1:06:18
of um the compliance issues here that
1:06:22
you know like just this week the the
1:06:25
British Prime Minister Kama has been
1:06:27
rattling his saber at tech companies
1:06:29
about this very issue of like kids
1:06:31
having access to adult content. And so I
1:06:35
thought that the timing was quite
1:06:37
interesting and I know this has been an
1:06:39
an issue with legislators in the US as
1:06:41
well and like states are introducing
1:06:44
their own
1:06:46
different legislation. I think from
1:06:47
Apple's perspective
1:06:49
the worst situation of all would be in
1:06:51
in America you have 50 states that each
1:06:54
legislate in a different way and you've
1:06:56
got a whole patchwork of different
1:06:58
regulations that you have to comply with
1:06:59
for every state and then you've got the
1:07:02
rest of the world as well. So I I took
1:07:05
this as Apple made a big feature of it
1:07:08
and I'm not cynical. I do think when
1:07:10
they say, you know, we're parents and we
1:07:11
take this seriously. I believe that. But
1:07:13
I think also they by taking the
1:07:16
initiative and trying to get out in
1:07:18
front of the issue, they're maybe trying
1:07:19
to lead legislators in terms of look,
1:07:21
you don't need to legislate. Trust us.
1:07:24
We're parents and we're nice people and
1:07:25
we've done this thing and it's the
1:07:27
answer. I think which is probably a bit
1:07:29
optimistic, but I I think that that to
1:07:32
me was what the whole section was is
1:07:33
please don't legislate because we've got
1:07:36
this.
1:07:37
>> And a lot of these features are not
1:07:38
actually new. They've been in screen
1:07:40
time and parental controls for a while.
1:07:43
They're just calling attention. I guess
1:07:44
they redesigned the the interface a
1:07:46
little bit. They might have improved
1:07:47
screen time behind the scenes to not be
1:07:49
absolute garbage, but um they're not
1:07:53
entirely new features. Overall, I I'm
1:07:56
not a fan of these. I mean, no, I don't
1:07:58
have kids, but I I do know what it's
1:08:00
like to grow up, you know, on the
1:08:02
internet. And it's having digital
1:08:04
freedom, I think, is is very important
1:08:06
to be able to a as a step of growing up
1:08:08
and discovering who you are and like
1:08:11
deciding what your kids can see and like
1:08:13
going down with like a strict hammer on
1:08:15
on cutting them off from the world. That
1:08:17
can
1:08:18
>> It's sad. I I find it's genuinely sad.
1:08:21
>> Maybe not for a six-year-old, though. I
1:08:23
mean,
1:08:24
>> you know, maybe, you know, maybe don't
1:08:26
want to make a 17-year-old ask you every
1:08:28
time they want to go visit a website,
1:08:30
but uh
1:08:31
>> yeah, but I think of a lot of people who
1:08:32
have who have extremely stricter parents
1:08:34
who treat their kids like their property
1:08:37
and they don't let them make decisions
1:08:38
for their own. And yeah, they will cut
1:08:41
down on things like that until they are
1:08:42
18 and so long as they're living in the
1:08:44
house, probably even longer. I mean, I
1:08:45
have I have adult friends who still have
1:08:48
to live with their parents due to
1:08:49
financial situations who are not out to
1:08:51
their parents because they're afraid of
1:08:52
being cut off. It's still a real thing
1:08:55
for for kids and like grown adults,
1:08:58
afraid to talk to their parents about
1:08:59
these things.
1:09:00
>> I hope Apple isn't allowing parents to
1:09:03
control what their grown adult children
1:09:05
do on their iPhones.
1:09:06
>> Yeah. I mean, not just kids, like people
1:09:08
who have abusive partners as well. This
1:09:09
is a major issue as well.
1:09:11
>> Yeah. I mean, my, you know, my kids are
1:09:12
all grown now. They're all in their
1:09:14
their their late 20s and early 30s and
1:09:15
they sort of grew up in that early
1:09:17
they're digital kids too, you know,
1:09:19
digital first kids. They had the iPhone
1:09:20
when they were little kids and uh we
1:09:22
never ever put any control whatsoever on
1:09:25
whatever they looked at which and and
1:09:27
and I think it was better to educate the
1:09:29
kids, you know, like to to to try to
1:09:31
help them and but we have a great
1:09:32
relationship with our kids, you know,
1:09:33
very very open and we're not controlling
1:09:36
we try to be as not controlling. We try,
1:09:39
you know, we try to help them develop
1:09:41
into, you know, healthy adults that can
1:09:43
make their own decisions and and to be
1:09:46
autonomous as much as possible. I
1:09:48
remember one time, you know, like I
1:09:49
don't know, you like I I made my
1:09:50
daughter change a car on a tire on our
1:09:53
car, a wheel on our car, you know, and
1:09:55
and she keeps bringing this up like it's
1:09:57
a
1:09:58
>> oh my god, like but you know, now she
1:09:59
knows how to now she knows how to change
1:10:01
a wheel on a car. I that was always my
1:10:04
philosophy is like listen you know
1:10:05
empower the kids be there be supportive
1:10:10
don't block things don't tell them they
1:10:11
can't you know don't take that that
1:10:14
>> I mean you're not raising them to be a
1:10:15
kid you're raising them to be an adult
1:10:18
>> as my philosophy as somebody who does
1:10:20
doesn't have kids
1:10:20
>> yeah yeah [laughter]
1:10:22
>> but then again things have changed you
1:10:23
know like there is a lot of that you
1:10:25
know social you know my
1:10:28
I can't I don't want to name it for
1:10:29
privacy reasons but a close relative of
1:10:31
mine a kid you spends she I I think she
1:10:34
spends too much. She she texts with ALI
1:10:36
all day
1:10:37
>> every day and the the you know the
1:10:40
screen time issues um I think that is a
1:10:43
that that's something I would take a
1:10:44
look at now you know like in other words
1:10:46
you know the digital landscape is
1:10:47
>> I think about this as well like when I
1:10:48
was a kid on the internet in 2002 I was
1:10:50
one of the only kids on the internet in
1:10:52
2002 there wasn't there wasn't and there
1:10:54
certainly wasn't like a big business of
1:10:56
social media trying to capture my
1:10:57
attention uh like very very different uh
1:11:01
I'm I'm glad I don't have to deal with
1:11:03
this problem social media and cyber
1:11:05
bullying
1:11:07
is a big and emerging issue for kids.
1:11:09
And I think sometimes, you know, cyber
1:11:11
bullying is scary for adults and I think
1:11:13
it can be terrifying for kids. And so I
1:11:16
totally get why parents would want to be
1:11:18
able to control who gets to communicate
1:11:21
with with their kids and to intervene.
1:11:23
And I I can see it's a difficult
1:11:24
balancing act because I understand what
1:11:26
you're saying Griffin too about uh kids
1:11:29
needing to have some autonomy to
1:11:31
discover themselves and you know so I
1:11:33
don't think it's an easy balance to
1:11:36
reach. Um yeah I only have a dog. I
1:11:38
don't have kids but if if I did have
1:11:40
kids that issue of cyber bullying or
1:11:43
people being mean to kids online when
1:11:45
they're just kids that that worries me
1:11:48
you know and I think it's a real issue.
1:11:50
>> I agree. I agree. I agree. All right,
1:11:52
let's let's talk real quick um about
1:11:54
watch OS. Um there was uh and Graeme, do
1:11:58
you want to tell us about this uh you
1:12:00
know the change?
1:12:01
>> Yeah, watch 27 introduces a dynamic app
1:12:04
grid that places the new standalone Siri
1:12:07
app at the center surrounded by other
1:12:09
suggested apps which include your most
1:12:11
popular and recent ones. I'm a little
1:12:14
dubious about that personally because I
1:12:16
mean they they've fiddled around with
1:12:17
the Frog Spawn app menu over the years
1:12:20
with World
1:12:22
and and they're [laughter] always kind
1:12:23
of I I felt they kind of nailed it with
1:12:25
the last one, I was quite happy with
1:12:27
with with where they'd arrived at in the
1:12:29
frog spawn. I didn't use it. I used to
1:12:31
switch to the the menu option, but with
1:12:33
the the new one where they had like more
1:12:35
of a solid grid with larger buttons and
1:12:38
I I thought they kind of nailed that. So
1:12:40
this I don't know and it's sticking the
1:12:42
Siri app icon right in the center. It
1:12:45
feels a bit like suddenly with Siri AI
1:12:49
Apple has a golden hammer so everything
1:12:50
looks like a nail and it's like I don't
1:12:53
know how useful Siri AI will actually be
1:12:56
on Apple Watch and I'm not sure it's the
1:12:59
app that I would put in the center. You
1:13:03
know, for me, it would probably be the
1:13:04
workout app. And
1:13:05
>> especially because on the Apple Watch,
1:13:06
like you don't need to access Siri by
1:13:10
tapping a button through an app icon.
1:13:12
You can just hold it up to your wrist
1:13:13
and just start talking to it and it
1:13:14
listens. I don't really know. I I
1:13:17
hopefully you can change it. What I'm
1:13:18
curious about is like uh so there's like
1:13:20
a a grid just a small hexagon grid of
1:13:23
seven icons, five apps, Siri in the
1:13:26
middle, and then another one on [snorts]
1:13:28
the bottom that's like another icon of
1:13:31
another seven icons. And what I want to
1:13:33
know is what happens when you tap on
1:13:34
that list. Does it bring you back to the
1:13:36
giant honeycomb of icons? Does it bring
1:13:38
you back to the list view?
1:13:39
>> I'm really curious about that. And I
1:13:41
can't figure it out because my watch is
1:13:42
too old to run watch OS 27.
1:13:45
>> Almost everybody's is.
1:13:47
>> Yeah, it just feel like fiddling and
1:13:49
maybe trying to trying to make Siri
1:13:52
happen. And as you say, Griffin, it's
1:13:54
kind of like the the only thing you
1:13:56
really need is to raise your wrist and
1:13:57
and talk to Siri. Not sure that on Apple
1:14:00
Watch you really even need the app
1:14:02
because that's only if you want to go
1:14:03
back and look at past chats. And I think
1:14:05
if I needed to do that, I would probably
1:14:07
do that on the iPhone anyway. So it it
1:14:10
it felt a bit extraneous. Um the next
1:14:13
point, the Siri app will let you start
1:14:15
conversations right from your wrist,
1:14:16
which you already can do, and or you can
1:14:19
also ask a question on your iPhone and
1:14:21
then pick up where you left off on the
1:14:23
Apple Watch. I find that hard to imagine
1:14:26
when you would use that as well. I mean,
1:14:28
okay, but then Workout Buddy now
1:14:32
motivates you based on your fitness
1:14:34
history and new data insights, including
1:14:36
your progress for pace, distance, and
1:14:38
workout duration, and it works without a
1:14:40
nearby iPhone. So, Griffin, that that is
1:14:43
what you were saying earlier. They also
1:14:45
I was really surprised, but in the
1:14:46
keynote, they made a big thing about it
1:14:48
being in Spanish now, which I I thought
1:14:50
was great, but it's like why are they
1:14:52
singling out that one language? I mean,
1:14:54
it's obviously the most important one,
1:14:56
but what why are they singling out like
1:14:59
Fitness Buddy in in Spanish? I thought
1:15:01
that was a bit weird, but I'm glad that
1:15:03
it is in Spanish now. I don't know. I
1:15:05
I've never used Workout Buddy. I I'm
1:15:07
kind of deaf.
1:15:08
>> I It drives me crazy. It's I I have to
1:15:11
turn it off these days cuz like
1:15:12
initially it was great and then Well,
1:15:14
not great. It was okay. But now it's
1:15:16
annoying. [laughter] So now I just I the
1:15:19
one good thing is if you're listening
1:15:20
with AirPods once it once it starts to
1:15:22
speak you can just click it and it it
1:15:25
dismisses it.
1:15:26
>> But I I you know like the current
1:15:28
version thing it tends to surface stats
1:15:30
that I really don't care about. It says
1:15:32
oh this is your third workout this week
1:15:34
or you've exercised 4,000 hours you know
1:15:36
this this year. I don't care about you
1:15:38
know those aren't the stats I care
1:15:40
about. In the middle it gives you more
1:15:42
>> uh interesting stats about your pace. I
1:15:44
ride a bike, you know, so about my pace
1:15:46
and speed and stuff like that. But the
1:15:49
the initial ones are I I I don't think
1:15:51
uh initially when it, you know, it just
1:15:52
tells you about the the frequency of
1:15:54
your workouts, which you kind of know
1:15:55
anyway or really I don't I don't really
1:15:57
care about. I don't know. I'm not really
1:15:59
sure that anyone would care about that,
1:16:00
but when I'm mowing the lawn, I do an
1:16:02
outdoor walk workout and workout buddy
1:16:06
comes on and almost every time it says,
1:16:09
"You've just set a new elevation
1:16:10
record." Like how is is my wand getting
1:16:14
taller every other week every time I mow
1:16:16
my lawn? I I don't know why it thinks
1:16:18
that. Um, also I also use work when I'm
1:16:20
when I'm going on a bike ride and um it
1:16:23
chimes in like,
1:16:25
>> "Oh, you've just done like a split when
1:16:27
you're riding your bike." And I don't
1:16:28
know what that means cuz it's I've gone
1:16:30
longer than a mile and it's always some
1:16:32
odd interval like 38 minutes or 35
1:16:35
minutes and I don't know when it decides
1:16:37
to tell me that I've hit a mile marker
1:16:41
because it as far as I can tell it's not
1:16:42
any milestone that I can discern. Do you
1:16:45
know what that's about?
1:16:46
>> It's depend. It'll be every mile or
1:16:48
every kilometer depending on which
1:16:50
you've got and it will say split one. I
1:16:52
don't think that's Workout Buddy. I
1:16:53
think that predates Workout Buddy. It
1:16:56
would just tell you what your split pace
1:16:57
was for the last kilometer or mile.
1:17:00
>> They also they they claim that they've
1:17:01
made uh the uh treadmill runs more more
1:17:07
accurate. I don't really understand how
1:17:10
or why. Um something I am interested in
1:17:13
more widgets appear in your smart stack
1:17:15
when they're relevant. So earlier this
1:17:17
year, I spent ages building this
1:17:18
beautiful widget for the smart stack for
1:17:21
my fitness app and only to discover that
1:17:24
the smart stack never displays it. And
1:17:26
it doesn't, which is like really
1:17:28
annoying. It doesn't display it because
1:17:30
the smart stack has its own workout
1:17:32
widget, which it always displays at the
1:17:34
top when there's an active workout, even
1:17:36
if it's a third party fitness app. And
1:17:40
then the smart stack doesn't display two
1:17:42
widgets if there's an active workout.
1:17:45
And so the smart stack isn't very smart
1:17:48
because their built-in smart stack
1:17:50
widget just shows the duration of the
1:17:52
workout and nothing else. And you know
1:17:55
because my my fitness app is a it's a
1:17:57
strength training app. And so my widget
1:17:59
shows an illustration of the exercise
1:18:01
you're doing, the name of the exercise,
1:18:03
the the reps and the weight. And it it
1:18:06
also shows the elapse time of the
1:18:07
workout. And it's way better. But uh the
1:18:09
smart stack doesn't show it. And the
1:18:11
only solution to that is you have to
1:18:12
kind of go in and pin it basically so
1:18:15
that it always stays in the smart stack.
1:18:17
So I'm hoping that their improved logic
1:18:19
for the smart stack will mean that all
1:18:20
that work and it it is a lot of work
1:18:23
that I put into my smart stack widget
1:18:25
will finally pay off because I bet a lot
1:18:27
of people don't even realize it's there
1:18:29
and it's kind of cool. Thank you. Smart
1:18:31
Stack
1:18:32
>> Smarter Smart Stack on the Apple Watch
1:18:33
was something that I was very pleased to
1:18:35
hear about. Uh music playback on Apple
1:18:37
Watch now starts faster. Um, I really
1:18:40
hope they fix this playback stuff
1:18:42
because I I'm like a hearing aid user
1:18:44
and my hearing aids, they're made for
1:18:46
iPhone hearing aids and that ironically
1:18:48
means they don't connect directly to
1:18:50
Apple Watch. If I have Bluetooth hearing
1:18:52
aids, those work with Apple Watch
1:18:54
because I went to the trouble of getting
1:18:55
ones that support Apple technology. They
1:18:58
don't work with Apple Watch. So, if I'm
1:19:00
like taking the dog for a walk and I'm
1:19:01
listening to a podcast, then my hearing
1:19:04
aids have to connect to the iPhone, not
1:19:07
the watch. So, I can use the watch as a
1:19:11
kind of second screen for my iPhone
1:19:13
podcast app, but it is so flaky. And I'm
1:19:16
really hoping when they've said this is
1:19:18
the year of fixing bugs that they
1:19:20
finally fix that. And it's a very bad
1:19:23
experience for people with May for
1:19:24
iPhone hearing aids. But I from what I
1:19:26
hear, it's a really bad experience for
1:19:28
just people using AirPods and and their
1:19:31
Apple Watch as well. you know, it
1:19:32
frequently just forgets what you were
1:19:34
last playing and you have to fish around
1:19:36
on your iPhone to find that again. And
1:19:39
this is something that we've seen so
1:19:42
many regressions on this because when
1:19:43
the original Apple Watch came out, this
1:19:46
was robust. You know, when when I played
1:19:48
something on my iPhone, it always
1:19:51
appeared on my watch. Always. And it's
1:19:54
just got progressively worse over the
1:19:56
years to the point that I think some
1:19:58
people have been giving up on the
1:19:59
platform. So, I really hope when they're
1:20:00
like sweating the details and fixing the
1:20:02
glitches, there's some serious glitches
1:20:05
here. And the fact that they're talking
1:20:07
about making playing music faster on
1:20:09
Apple Watch, I hope what that means is
1:20:12
they've really looked at the whole now
1:20:14
playing experience on Apple Watch and
1:20:16
and given it a tuneup because it really
1:20:18
needs it. Just one more thing to say on
1:20:19
Apple Watch is that they they don't even
1:20:21
support the Apple Watch Ultra now with
1:20:23
the Watch OS 27, which blows my mind.
1:20:25
That's only like three years old. And I
1:20:27
use an Apple Watch Ultra as my test
1:20:29
device when I'm developing. And so I I I
1:20:32
now what I have to buy a new Apple Watch
1:20:34
so that I can my old Apple Watch Ultra 3
1:20:37
becomes my test device. And if I buy
1:20:39
that now, then it's going to be so
1:20:40
annoying because there'll be new Apple
1:20:42
Watches coming out in the fall. So I'm
1:20:44
frustrated by that news.
1:20:47
>> I I I saw some reports that they managed
1:20:49
to get it working on the original Ultra.
1:20:50
>> Oh, really?
1:20:51
>> I don't know how or Yeah, I saw
1:20:53
something on on socials here on Twitter.
1:20:56
I'll look into that.
1:20:57
>> True.
1:20:58
>> But [laughter]
1:20:59
>> yeah,
1:21:01
>> who knows? Let's let's move on. Let's
1:21:03
let's skip the vision aware stuff and
1:21:05
and uh go to Dubdub DC predictions. And
1:21:08
I have a request. Griffin,
1:21:11
>> please make this as quick as possible.
1:21:13
>> Okay. [laughter]
1:21:16
>> So, if if you're new to the show, last
1:21:18
week we uh talked about our predictions
1:21:20
for the event. Um, Leander was scared of
1:21:23
playing the the game, so he avoided
1:21:25
being on the show.
1:21:27
>> It's one of my favorite things.
1:21:28
>> Oh, yeah. I can tell. [laughter]
1:21:31
>> Yes, I was really bummed that I missed
1:21:33
it.
1:21:33
>> So, now that the event has happened, we
1:21:35
can see who was right and wrong. Um, the
1:21:38
first prediction in the software
1:21:40
section, Liquid Glass UI significantly
1:21:41
dialed back. Uh, all of us voted no on
1:21:44
this, but I mean, looking at Mac OS, I
1:21:47
think it's pretty clear that that's
1:21:48
absolutely the case. they walked back so
1:21:51
many of the changes that they uh that
1:21:53
they introduced just last year like with
1:21:55
the sidebars, the app icons, the menu
1:21:57
bar icons, the you know the the
1:22:00
translucency and the toolbarss. So that
1:22:03
was that was one of the more unanimous
1:22:05
picks among our listeners as well and uh
1:22:07
everybody got that wrong. Um software
1:22:10
updates explicitly called out as
1:22:12
improving stability and performance. Uh
1:22:14
I voted for that so that's a point for
1:22:16
me. They may say stability beginning.
1:22:19
>> That was like the first 15 minutes of
1:22:21
the keynote where they talked about I
1:22:22
never heard the word stability once.
1:22:24
>> They did.
1:22:25
>> I never heard the word stability.
1:22:27
>> Yeah, I have questions about this
1:22:29
adjudication.
1:22:31
>> That was the whole thing. It's like,
1:22:32
yeah, of course they're going to talk
1:22:34
about performance, but they're never
1:22:35
going to say the word stability.
1:22:37
>> Yeah, it looks like a bit of selfdeing
1:22:39
there. I think you need to reverse. I
1:22:41
think look they they spent like 20
1:22:43
minutes talking about all of the
1:22:44
improvements that they that they made to
1:22:46
the software update. They made it a
1:22:47
whole section. They they they went they
1:22:49
gave us like so many statistics. AirDrop
1:22:51
is 70% faster. Connecting to a Wi-Fi
1:22:53
network is faster. I think that
1:22:56
>> yeah performance
1:22:57
>> performance this is I specifically said
1:23:00
when this question came up I said yes
1:23:01
they will definitely talk about
1:23:02
performance. They will not mention
1:23:04
stability and that's why I said no.
1:23:06
>> Okay. Well in that case um all right
1:23:08
well I'll change that then.
1:23:10
We'll see if that affect how that
1:23:12
affects the scores. [snorts] Um, Apple
1:23:15
reintroduces smarter agent Siri with
1:23:17
personal context. That is a yes. Apple
1:23:20
says Google powers some new Apple
1:23:22
intelligence features in the main
1:23:23
keynote. Uh, yeah, a lot of us voted for
1:23:26
that. Uh, so that's a point for Louis,
1:23:29
myself, and Charlie. Xcode for iPad.
1:23:32
That was a no. That's another point for
1:23:34
Lewis, myself, and Charlie. Mac OS is
1:23:37
called Big Bear. I don't still
1:23:39
[laughter] don't entirely understand
1:23:40
where that rumor came from.
1:23:42
>> All of us all of us get a point for
1:23:44
that. So, because none of us thought it
1:23:46
was going to happen. Vision OS gets more
1:23:48
than 5 minutes of screen time. Uh,
1:23:50
obviously that didn't happen. Basically,
1:23:52
none of the software updates [laughter]
1:23:53
got more than five minutes of screen
1:23:55
time. They didn't really talk about
1:23:56
those at all. Hardware updated Mac Mini
1:23:58
and Mac Studio with M5 chips. That is a
1:24:00
big fat no. Uh, so that's a point for
1:24:03
Lewis and Graham. Uh, Stephen Lame
1:24:06
appears on screen or in voiceover.
1:24:10
>> No, nowhere to be seen.
1:24:12
>> My only wild card guess.
1:24:15
[laughter]
1:24:15
>> Yeah. Finally, Tim Cook appears on
1:24:18
screen for more than three minutes. This
1:24:20
one was very close actually [laughter]
1:24:23
because I realized the quote is actually
1:24:25
written to say Tim Cook appears on
1:24:27
screen. So, all the parts where he's
1:24:29
talking, but they have like something
1:24:31
else on screen, like promotional
1:24:33
pictures of stuff, I had to cut that out
1:24:34
because he wasn't appearing on screen.
1:24:36
And it came down to 3 minutes and 4
1:24:39
seconds.
1:24:41
>> Very tight. [laughter]
1:24:42
>> These are always the hardest things
1:24:44
trying to figure out. Oh my god.
1:24:47
>> Yeah. [snorts]
1:24:48
So, um I guess we don't know who the
1:24:50
winner is. I'll have to I'll have to,
1:24:51
you know, I'll defer to Dave as our
1:24:53
independent judge as to whether they
1:24:57
improved performance or not.
1:25:00
>> I question the liquid glass thing
1:25:01
because I don't regard it as being a
1:25:03
significant dialing back of liquid
1:25:04
glass. It's still liquid glass and
1:25:07
you've still got I mean, you've got a
1:25:08
slider now, but you know, I I think
1:25:11
they've finessed liquid glass, but
1:25:12
liquid glass is is still right there.
1:25:14
They haven't really significantly
1:25:15
changed it at all. Just looks a bit
1:25:18
crisper by default. I in a lot of ways
1:25:20
on Mac OS they just completely reverted
1:25:21
it. Like uh title bars don't have like
1:25:24
the progressive blur anymore. They're
1:25:26
just like a flat edge on top. They don't
1:25:27
have the sidebar, the liquid glass
1:25:29
sidebar at all. It's now just what it
1:25:31
was before from big sir and earlier.
1:25:33
>> Liquid glass is a material, right?
1:25:35
>> It it's not really made of glass.
1:25:37
Graeme, [laughter]
1:25:40
>> liquid glass is typically a material
1:25:42
that you can use in your UI. It's like
1:25:45
the tab bar is made of liquid glass. The
1:25:47
buttons in the toolbar are made of
1:25:48
liquid glass. That's what liquid glass
1:25:50
is.
1:25:50
>> It wouldn't make any difference to the
1:25:52
scores though because we all said the
1:25:53
same thing. So, it would flip all of us.
1:25:55
>> That's true. Um,
1:25:57
>> you're just ganging up on me. [laughter]
1:26:00
>> I actually explicitly mentioned this
1:26:01
last week. I said, "Yeah, I know liquid
1:26:03
glass is technically the name of the
1:26:04
material, but the broader user interface
1:26:06
design is what what the pick is about."
1:26:09
And I think that it's it's significantly
1:26:12
changed on the Mac. So, I guess we we
1:26:14
don't know who the winner is yet because
1:26:15
I'll have to wait for uh I'll I'll have
1:26:17
to ask Dave for his ruling uh on that
1:26:19
one pick.
1:26:20
>> Get out the powdered wig.
1:26:22
>> Yeah. Yeah. But tenatively [laughter]
1:26:25
tentatively how how I have it ruled is
1:26:27
that the two winners are Lewis and I
1:26:29
both with seven points, Graham with
1:26:31
five, and Charlie with six. We had one
1:26:33
listener, Steven Morgan, who scored nine
1:26:35
points.
1:26:37
>> There's always a nine points.
1:26:38
>> I know. I know. Crazy.
1:26:41
>> Wow.
1:26:42
off the charts.
1:26:42
>> But I mean, don't congratulate him yet.
1:26:44
We'll see. Uh follow follow up on next
1:26:46
week's episode. So,
1:26:48
>> yeah, whatever, Stephen.
1:26:49
>> So, we don't find out what Steven wanted
1:26:51
to promote until until the adjudication
1:26:54
is complete.
1:26:55
>> Well, uh I can tell you now that
1:26:57
Stephven Morgan uh when asked if there
1:27:00
was something he wanted to plug, he said
1:27:02
no.
1:27:03
[laughter]
1:27:04
>> What?
1:27:04
>> Fantastic.
1:27:06
>> Good for him, I guess. We'll see.
1:27:08
[sighs and gasps]
1:27:09
>> Yeah. Well, we'll plug maybe we can plug
1:27:11
Stephen himself.
1:27:12
>> Yeah, Steven Morgan, we congratulate
1:27:15
you. Maybe tentatively.
1:27:18
[laughter]
1:27:20
>> Uh, I think I think we should wrap it up
1:27:22
there, don't you guys? Anyone else got
1:27:23
anything to add?
1:27:26
>> It's a wrap. [laughter]
1:27:28
>> Let's not drag this out any longer.
1:27:30
Please give us a fivestar rating. At
1:27:32
least five stars or or a review in Apple
1:27:34
Podcast. Definitely a review. Um, and
1:27:37
and not a not a not a onestar one. uh or
1:27:39
share the show with anyone who you think
1:27:41
who would like to listen. Um we come in
1:27:44
significantly shorter than some of our
1:27:46
competing shows which I think is a
1:27:48
definite plus. Um text us on iMessage at
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1:27:54
That's [email protected].
1:27:56
Send questions, comments, feedback for
1:27:57
the show. You can send an audio message
1:27:58
or a short video and we'll play it. Uh
1:28:00
thanks everyone for listening. Thanks
1:28:01
for watching [music] and we'll see you
1:28:02
all next time. Have a great weekend
1:28:03
everybody.
1:28:04
>> Bye bye. Goodbye.
1:28:06
>> See you.
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