Up next in 10
This week: It’s a revolving door at Apple Park — Tim Cook is out, John Ternus is in, Cosmic Orange is out, Dark Cherry is in, and MagSafe is out, except it might also be in!
Produced by Extra Ordinary for Cult of Mac
Music composed by Will Davenport, arranged by D. Griffin Jones
Chapters:
0:00 - Intro: Griffin’s trip
7:01 - Tim Cook retires as CEO
22:44 - Where Tim Cook ranks among Apple CEOs
34:42 - Ternus’s leadership style
41:47 - Ternus promises Apple will “change the world once again”
54:27 - iPhone 18 Pro colors
1:00:22 - Folding iPhone with MagSafe?
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Show More Show Less View Video Transcript
0:00
Coming up, it's a revolving door at
0:02
Apple Park. Tim Cook is out, John Ternus
0:04
is in. Cosmic Orange is out, dark cherry
0:07
is in. And MagSafe is out, except it
0:09
might also be in.
0:13
Welcome to the Cult of Mac podcast. I'm
0:14
your host, Leander Kahney. Joining me
0:15
today is Lewis Wallace. What's up,
0:17
Lewis? Hey, it's a great day to be
0:18
podcasting. Everything's going perfectly
0:21
as per usual. Not a single technical
0:23
problem on the Cult of Mac podcast. It's
0:25
fantastic to be here.
0:27
This is how long we've been messing
0:28
around for a complete hour, right?
0:31
Trying to get this thing to work. Yeah.
0:33
Microphone problems, headphone problems.
0:35
The occasional horrible sneeze.
0:37
Yeah. Oh my god, I had one, yeah. And it
0:39
came out of my eye.
0:41
>> [laughter]
0:43
>> All right. Then we've got a We also have
0:44
um, you know, uh what's his face? What's
0:46
your name again? Um,
0:47
Griffin Griffin John. Sorry.
0:49
>> [laughter]
0:49
>> This has not been a great morning.
0:53
Yep. Um,
0:54
you know, you know, speaking of a
0:56
computer
0:57
setup changes, uh the viewers might
1:00
notice on on YouTube that I've got yet
1:02
another new computer behind me. Uh
1:05
I I went to a concert last weekend in
1:07
the Pittsburgh area, visited a friend
1:09
who had this uh Apple iMac sitting in
1:12
his garage for a number of years, and so
1:14
I I
1:15
you know, brought home a stray. Uh but
1:19
that is not the most exciting thing that
1:20
happened. I'm going to share my screen
1:22
with the two of you. Put this Put this
1:24
in the show as well. Good Good time to
1:25
watch the YouTube video, I'll say. So, I
1:28
went to the Large Scale Systems Museum,
1:31
which is a computer museum in the
1:32
Pittsburgh area. The first floor is all
1:35
a bunch of like really big, very rare
1:38
mainframes. This is a
1:41
Singer System 10. Yes, Singer, the um
1:44
the the the sewing machine company. They
1:46
made a
1:47
>> Really?
1:47
>> They They made a computer. It's very
1:49
bizarre. I was
1:51
The this guy was very cheerfully
1:52
explaining to me like the basics of how
1:54
the system works. It's extremely
1:56
strange. It went in one ear and out the
1:58
other, but very bizarre machine. A Cray
2:02
supercomputer, you might recognize that
2:04
name. Kind of looks like something out
2:07
of Star Wars. Wow. Um
2:09
I was shown this uh IBM uh mainframe
2:13
that's hooked up to all these different
2:15
terminals. He was showing me how to use
2:17
this thing. These are like used in like
2:18
banking systems. He showed me some of
2:20
the software there.
2:22
And so, you know, first hour and a half
2:24
I was like being shown all these
2:25
mainframe systems. Then I had like about
2:26
25 minutes left, and I was like And then
2:28
at the just at the end, the the guy who
2:30
was giving me the tour says, "Oh yeah,
2:32
and you know, upstairs we have a bunch
2:33
of home computers if you'd like to see
2:34
those." And I said, "Oh yeah, sure." Uh
2:36
I go upstairs, and I go around a corner
2:38
to like where they have a lot of Apples.
2:40
And what do I see, but one of the rarest
2:43
Apple computers in the world, a
2:45
completely functional, all original
2:47
system of one out of maybe
2:50
50 on the planet, a completely original
2:54
Apple Lisa. And
2:56
almost all of You can see how many other
2:58
computers are in this room like in the
2:59
background. This is the one I just
3:01
instantly bolted towards.
3:03
Not only
3:05
it's completely functional,
3:07
I got to boot it up,
3:09
and I had like a few minutes where I was
3:10
just like messing with it. Like an
3:11
original Apple Lisa office system. Cool.
3:14
>> The original keyboard, mouse, profile
3:16
hard disk, both of the Twiggy drives I'm
3:18
told are completely functional, which is
3:20
a miracle.
3:22
On the table, literally across the way
3:24
from it,
3:26
an original BeBox running BeOS from the
3:29
mid-90s. The dual processor system, the
3:31
blinking lights,
3:32
BeOS, the operating system that Apple
3:35
almost bought instead of uh NeXTSTEP. Uh
3:39
you'll notice right next to it is a
3:41
NeXTcube and a megapixel display.
3:45
I only had a few minutes with this
3:46
thing, so I I didn't even
3:48
I was standing next to a NeXTcube that I
3:50
didn't even touch because I was so
3:52
enamored with all of the other
3:53
incredibly rare machines around me. I
3:56
saw an Apple 3. I saw
3:58
a a Commodore PET, which was another
4:01
like rare computer from the mid-70s
4:03
alongside the Apple 2. Very exciting
4:05
day. Um
4:07
I will definitely be going back.
4:09
I've got many ideas for videos I'd like
4:10
to record with all these machines
4:12
because again, all of them are
4:12
completely functional. Um
4:15
What
4:16
What was the Lisa like? Is it like a
4:17
Mac?
4:19
Yeah, it's like a weird Macintosh before
4:21
they settled on like a lot of the
4:23
standard like user interface and
4:25
engineering things. It runs um the same
4:29
the same almost the same processor as
4:30
the Mac.
4:32
Uh it
4:33
doesn't use square pixels. It has a
4:35
rectang- It renders its screen as a
4:37
giant rectangle and then squishes it
4:39
horizontally so that they can have like
4:41
higher resolution text. Um
4:44
It's more powerful. It has a like more
4:46
RAM. It can do like full proper
4:48
multitasking where the original
4:49
Macintosh 128 couldn't. Um
4:53
but you know, it also cost
4:55
four times as much. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
4:57
yeah. Oh well, okay. The the the mouse
5:00
is almost like a Macintosh mouse. The
5:02
keyboard, I wasn't impressed with. It
5:04
looks like it would be like a big,
5:05
chunky, funky mechanical keyboard just
5:08
like the original Mac, but it was kind
5:09
of a lame keyboard, I'll admit. Mhm.
5:11
Yeah. Which surprised me. What Was the
5:13
Singer Was that the first
5:14
multi-threading computer?
5:17
>> [laughter]
5:18
>> I see what you did there.
5:20
Hey, so here's the real question.
5:22
Was there anybody else in there but you
5:24
and the guy that runs it?
5:26
Yes.
5:27
Uh [laughter]
5:28
I was
5:29
the only person there under the age of
5:31
40, but yes. Okay. [laughter]
5:33
All right, just had to ask.
5:35
That's kind of looks fascinating though,
5:37
man. I mean, honestly, I I
5:39
What's it called again? Tell people the
5:41
name it is. And The Large Scale Systems
5:42
Museum near Pittsburgh. That's catchy.
5:46
>> [laughter]
5:47
>> It's a bit of [snorts] a drive for me,
5:48
but worth it.
5:49
>> Pittsburgh Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania.
5:51
Pitts- Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, right?
5:53
Mhm. Did you have to pay to get in? Was
5:55
there an entrance fee? Nope, completely
5:57
free. And a lot of people there are like
5:59
volunteers.
6:00
>> you.
6:00
>> Yeah, retired retired [laughter]
6:01
engineers. Like one of them from AT&T,
6:03
AOL. Yeah.
6:05
That looks That That does look
6:07
interesting, man. I I've never seen a
6:08
Cray supercomputer like that.
6:11
Mhm. Apple
6:13
briefly
6:14
used used a Cray for like research and
6:16
development in the late '80s.
6:19
They [snorts] Didn't they Most of them
6:20
were circular with seats inside, weren't
6:22
they?
6:23
Yeah, that's how big some of them were.
6:24
>> Wow. And
6:25
>> [snorts]
6:26
>> if you open them up, the um the mass of
6:28
wires is is insane. And they were
6:30
actually hired
6:32
um I believe seamstresses, right? Uh
6:36
From Singer?
6:36
>> There was like a an army [laughter]
6:37
Yeah, exactly. An army of
6:39
That's what made me think of it. There
6:40
was an army of women um that like
6:42
seamstresses that that that the wired
6:44
these things together, I believe. Ah,
6:46
that makes sense. Crazy.
6:48
Yeah, the And now a Cray I think is like
6:50
an Apple Watch outperforms a Cray, I
6:52
believe.
6:53
Yeah, something like that.
6:55
Madness.
6:56
All right. Well, that's Yeah, very cool.
6:57
Nice nice nice little show and
7:00
>> tell, though.
7:01
Let's talk about Tim Cook.
7:03
Kind of crazy news, wasn't it? Where the
7:05
heck did that come from? I mean, even
7:06
though we were all expecting it, Monday,
7:08
right? Uh
7:10
it was like, "Whoa, what's going on?"
7:12
>> Yeah, yeah, where were we when when this
7:14
news broke? I was, you know, it was
7:15
4:45. I was winding down my day. I think
7:17
I was like taking screenshots for a
7:18
how-to.
7:20
Uh
7:20
Lewis, you were getting your car like
7:22
smog tested or something.
7:23
>> just smog tested. I was at the smog
7:25
referee, very special smog test, very
7:28
California high-level. Man. And uh yeah,
7:31
I get I was sitting there waiting for
7:33
that, and I get the saying, "What? Tim
7:34
Cook is retiring? What?" I couldn't
7:36
believe it. Honestly couldn't believe
7:38
it.
7:38
>> errands of some kind. Where were you?
7:40
>> I had to run an errand, yeah.
7:42
So stupid. I thought it was a quiet
7:43
afternoon. I thought, "Yeah, perfect.
7:44
I'll just nip out real quick." Typical
7:46
sleepy Monday.
7:48
Yeah. I got caught in a horrible storm,
7:50
too. In fact, there was a big spinout.
7:52
This car went in front of me on the
7:52
freeway, went
7:54
hit the barrier, and went spinning
7:55
across three lanes of the freeway. But
7:57
then ended up miraculously in the on the
8:00
shoulder, completely unharmed. I mean,
8:01
they were super lucky, super super
8:03
lucky.
8:03
>> They were really blown away by the news
8:05
of Tim Cook retiring.
8:06
>> [laughter]
8:06
>> That's what we thought.
8:10
All right. Let's talk about it. What
8:12
What What's going on there, Lewis? Yeah,
8:13
so Tim Cook is stepping down. John
8:16
Ternus is stepping up to be the CEO of
8:19
Apple. This all happens in September.
8:21
Uh Cook is going to move into a new role
8:24
for him as executive chairman of Apple's
8:27
board of directors at that time.
8:29
Uh in the press release, they you know,
8:31
they announce this press release,
8:31
shocking everybody in the world,
8:33
especially Mark Gurman.
8:36
>> [laughter]
8:37
>> Uh Tim Cook said of John Ternus, just in
8:39
case you never heard of him, he's the
8:40
guy with the big chin who's been He's
8:42
been You've seen him a lot at
9:17
>> [snorts]
9:31
[laughter]
9:33
[snorts]
9:53
>> many of these Apple events. Nice you
9:55
know, hardware guy.
9:57
Seems like a very personable guy. Uh Tim
9:58
Cook said, "John Ternus has the mind of
9:58
an engineer, the soul of an innovator,
9:59
and the heart to lead
10:00
We've been talking about this for years.
10:01
He he has a way of or his staff who
10:05
writes his, you know, statements has a
10:07
way. The things that he says are so
10:10
balanced and so right on the money about
10:13
just about every single subject that
10:14
ever comes down the pike. And he says
10:16
things in a way that is, you know,
10:18
politically neutral and accurate and
10:22
just
10:23
I I mean it's the He is the antidote to
10:26
the current craziness we have where
10:28
everybody is just constantly, you know,
10:30
like the rhetoric is just getting ramped
10:31
up more and more, worse and worse,
10:33
crazier and crazier, race to the bottom.
10:35
I was going to say race to the bottom,
10:36
but it's like they found the bottom and
10:38
they, you know, bought brought some
10:39
drills with them and they're digging,
10:41
you know,
10:43
going toward the center of the
10:44
the earth. Anyway,
10:47
This all takes a place September 1st
10:49
this year and uh
10:51
you know, Apple's been planning for this
10:53
for ever for, you know, we've been
10:55
talking about it for a while.
10:58
There's been a lot of reporting about
10:59
how Apple's, you know, they want to hire
11:00
somebody from within.
11:03
Anyway, he's the guy. They also
11:05
in the same press release they or
11:07
actually I think it was separate press
11:08
release they they promoted Johny Srouji,
11:11
man who led the incredibly successful
11:12
development of Apple Silicon. He's going
11:13
to take over a new position at Apple,
11:15
chief hardware officer role. He's kind
11:17
of assuming uh
11:19
Turnus's jobs uh
11:21
He's going to
11:23
take over He was senior vice president
11:25
of hardware technologies. In fact,
11:26
that's what Apple's page still calls
11:27
him.
11:28
Uh he's going to
11:29
>> technologies
11:30
to to translate the weird vagueness of
11:32
that title. Apple gives a lot of vague
11:33
titles. Hardware technologies is Apple
11:36
Silicon, you know, all-encompassing
11:39
you know, that that that branch of the
11:40
company. They do other things too, but
11:41
primarily Apple Silicon, you know, the
11:44
technologies
11:45
inside the products. All the great like
11:48
modems and things that they've been
11:49
making lately in addition to all the
11:52
CPUs and stuff. But Uh he's also going
11:54
to Now he's going to take over uh role
11:56
leading hardware engineering, which is
11:57
what Turnus did before. Uh so that
12:01
that's effective immediately. He's
12:02
already taken over that role. So big
12:05
changes, you know, not uh not too
12:07
surprising. I mean, what was it? Maybe
12:10
I think it was in December or something
12:11
where the story basically Financial
12:13
Times saying like, "Oh yeah, you know,
12:15
Cook's going to retire between June, I'm
12:18
sorry, between January between late
12:21
January and June."
12:22
And uh
12:24
not technically retiring until
12:25
September, but uh you know, turns out
12:27
that report was
12:29
kind of on the money despite other
12:32
other assertions.
12:35
And of course, you know, Gurman had been
12:37
predicting Turnus was going to take over
12:38
for a long time. I mean, there you know,
12:39
a little bit of skepticism, but I it
12:41
seems to me like in retrospect that
12:43
you know, maybe these were
12:45
you know, purposeful leaks to try to
12:47
sort of test the waters, see what the
12:49
reaction was, kind of maybe.
12:52
Maybe. Yeah, I'm
12:54
>> [laughter]
12:55
>> I mean, obviously uh everybody on Wall
12:58
Street is looking at this and going,
12:59
"Hmm, you know, Tim Cook has done a
13:01
pretty good job of turning Apple into a
13:02
perpetual money machine for
13:05
forever, right?" I mean, he's it's it's
13:07
just been
13:09
even as the iPhone is sales have slowed,
13:12
even as the uh Apple car went poof, even
13:16
as the Vision Pro kind of landed with a
13:18
thud,
13:19
Apple's still making so much money. It's
13:21
It's just insane. So
13:23
>> [snorts]
13:23
>> uh Tim Cook, you know, with his sort of
13:26
you know, evenhanded and
13:28
penny-pinching, if I that's kind of got
13:31
a negative connotation, but I mean
13:32
>> [laughter]
13:33
>> I mean I mean, look, Apple's very
13:34
intentional with their R&D money. Yeah,
13:36
they blew like relatively a lot of money
13:39
on the Apple car and the Vision Pro, but
13:41
that's like what? One day's worth of
13:43
funding of all of the money that gets
13:45
dumped into AI by every company every
13:47
day. So Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
13:50
Well, the funny thing, you know, like
13:51
when when Tim Cook took I remember when
13:52
Tim Cook took over from Steve Jobs and
13:54
it was nothing but doom and gloom.
13:56
Everyone thought, "Oh god, this is going
13:57
to be a disaster. Apple's going to be
13:59
out of business in 18 months." There
14:01
were definitely predictions like that.
14:02
They thought like this is this is the
14:03
end for Apple, you know, it's it's not
14:05
going to
14:06
survive the Tim Cook regime. And now and
14:09
now it's Tim Cook's, you know, shoes are
14:11
the big shoes to fill. Like I think now
14:13
people are worried that that is Turnus
14:15
going to be up to the job that Tim Cook
14:16
did.
14:17
Um
14:19
I mean the
14:20
That was a very different transition
14:22
because it was it was so sudden. Like
14:23
Steve Jobs had began a medical leave.
14:26
He, you know,
14:27
retired from the role of CEO, but was
14:29
still going to stay on as chairman and
14:30
then 6 weeks later he, you know,
14:32
tragically passed. And so Tim Cook
14:34
didn't have anybody to lean on. I think
14:37
I think Apple is really banging the drum
14:38
of Tim Cook won't be gone.
14:41
He'll still be there as executive
14:43
chairman because they really want to
14:44
like make it clear to Wall Street, "Do
14:46
not freak out. We are planning this.
14:48
John Turnus will have Tim Cook. Tim Cook
14:51
is in good health. Tim Cook isn't going
14:52
anywhere." They keep saying that a lot.
14:55
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, Cook Cook
14:57
had been running Apple for for Jobs, I
14:59
mean, for quite a number of years
15:01
really. Jobs was kind of in some kind of
15:03
self-retirement and it didn't, you know,
15:04
publicly he was obviously the face of
15:06
the company and and still the active
15:08
CEO, but really Jobs was I'm sorry, Cook
15:10
was doing the day-to-day for for a long
15:12
time for quite a few years before
15:14
Jobs passed. But yeah, yeah, you're
15:16
right. And actually they made Cook made
15:18
a funny statement that he said that um
15:20
you know, the next 7 months or so
15:22
they're going to
15:24
he's going to be handing over to Turnus
15:25
and and he hoped that business schools
15:26
would be studying this. He said it's
15:28
going to be the best succession
15:31
you know, in in corporate history and
15:33
that he hoped that business schools
15:34
would study it and and talk about it for
15:35
future to come. So, you know, that is
15:37
kind of
15:38
that struck me as a bit odd really too
15:40
as well. Like almost as though the
15:41
transition starts now, the clock starts
15:44
now. I guess that's, you know, I guess
15:45
that is the case. Maybe there's nothing
15:46
that's so so surprising about it.
15:48
Yeah, I mean, honestly, like can you
15:51
imagine it going more smoothly than it
15:53
has? I mean, like it seems
15:56
people are optimistic about this change.
15:59
And if you think about it, like
16:01
I mean, hopefully hopefully
16:03
maybe this maybe Turnus will be, you
16:05
know, slightly more in the Steve Jobs
16:07
mold of maybe pushing things a little
16:10
bit further, a little bit faster. But
16:12
you still got Cook there, you know, to
16:14
make sure all the all the numbers add
16:16
up, right? And I and also like Tim
16:20
Cook's staying on
16:21
specifically calling out his role with
16:23
policy makers around the world. Very
16:26
diplomatic way of putting it.
16:28
>> [laughter]
16:29
>> They have one particular person in mind,
16:31
didn't they? Yeah, yeah, policy maker
16:33
around Washington, D.C.
16:36
Like that's, you know, a lot of people's
16:39
you you wrote a piece of a lot about
16:40
this lander this week that like that's,
16:42
you know, a stain I think on Tim Cook's
16:45
era of Apple. It's rubbed a lot of
16:46
people the the wrong way. Um and Tim
16:49
Cook continuing to do that for John
16:52
Turnus, well, John Turnus will be the
16:54
CEO. Like
16:55
he's taking that stain on his shirt into
16:57
like an arrow that he's taking for John,
16:58
making sure that this doesn't affect him
17:00
and his position as CEO like right at
17:03
the start of his career at the top.
17:04
>> Yeah. Yeah, it definitely and like you
17:06
know, it has rubbed rubbed a lot of
17:07
people the the wrong way, hasn't it?
17:08
Because, you know, Tim Cook's bona fides
17:09
with his
17:10
uh steady positions about the
17:11
environment and
17:14
you know, all all these different
17:15
issues. I mean, he's definitely left of
17:16
center and then
17:17
his his personal what appears to be a
17:19
personal friendship with Trump I think
17:21
really does uh
17:24
you know, rub a lot of Apple users the
17:25
wrong way. Like you know, donating to
17:27
the the inauguration and um
17:30
stuff like that uh
17:31
yeah, definitely has has I think, you
17:33
know, like some people are really
17:34
freaking out. You were saying Louis,
17:35
weren't you? Your band members like
17:37
um compared unfavorably to to to certain
17:41
historical figures. Yeah. I wouldn't get
17:44
into that. I think anybody who sort of,
17:46
you know, takes Cook to task for the way
17:48
that he has managed Trump it is
17:51
short-sighted. I mean, Trump is the
17:53
freaking president of the United States.
17:55
And he's
17:56
doing some crazy crap. And I'm sure that
17:59
Tim Cook is not going golfing with with
18:01
Trump and, you know, hanging out
18:03
buddy-buddies. I'm sure that if he
18:04
actually was truthful
18:07
and not diplomatic, which is I said
18:09
political, you said diplomatic and
18:11
you're right. It's he's he's diplomatic.
18:14
Uh he's he's apolitical. And
18:17
you know, he's he's done I mean
18:19
The thing
18:21
The thing where he delivered that uh
18:24
that stupid gold thing to Trump. I mean,
18:27
that that kind of rubbed [laughter] me
18:29
the wrong way. That was not a good look.
18:31
Uh he looked like a, you know,
18:33
>> I I thought my reaction was they're
18:35
taking the piss. He's making fun of
18:37
Trump. It's a gold brick. You
18:40
know, it's it's [laughter] it
18:42
it almost seemed like a joke and that's
18:43
why I thought he was nervous because
18:45
he [laughter] thought, "Oh god, they're
18:46
going to see through this, you know,
18:47
this is like I thought they were, you
18:48
know, like they cooked this up in some
18:50
in the boardroom and they were laughing
18:51
their heads off and they thought this is
18:52
going to be super hilarious."
18:54
And [laughter] then when he did it, he's
18:55
like he's himself because, you
18:58
know,
18:59
but they're going to see through this. I
19:00
mean, I I started laughing when I saw it
19:02
cuz I thought this this is just too on
19:03
the nose. This is just too bizarre. They
19:06
might as well have had a wheelbarrow of,
19:08
you know, like of cash. Like could it be
19:10
any more an obvious bribe than a gold
19:12
brick?
19:13
Well,
19:14
I mean, was it solid gold or was it
19:16
gold-plated?
19:18
>> gold. What? Oh, I guess it was plated. I
19:20
don't know. But yeah. The part of that
19:22
that rubbed me wrong was just, you know,
19:23
like how
19:25
Yeah, I mean, Cook almost looked like
19:27
something out of Game of Thrones or
19:29
somebody walks into somebody like, you
19:30
know, bows down, you know, like Yeah.
19:32
Yeah, yeah. I mean, his body language is
19:34
what bothered me more than anything,
19:35
[snorts] you know, it's like
19:37
really
19:37
>> it and assemble it on the on the
19:39
Resolute Desk, which is just
19:41
Yeah. But, you know, I I mean,
19:44
the end result is Apple didn't get
19:45
screwed by, you know, Trump deciding to
19:48
do something ridiculous, you know? I
19:50
mean, they they still took what? a a
19:52
billion dollar hit or something in
19:53
tariffs, which maybe they'll get back,
19:55
but uh
19:57
you know, I mean, I think overall, he
20:00
did a a good job of of dealing with
20:02
Trump, cuz I Trump is not a, you know,
20:04
he's he's not I don't think he's easy
20:05
guy to deal with.
20:07
To put it to put it mildly. And and you
20:10
know, after this happened, you know,
20:12
Trump in his own way sends out a
20:14
a message on Truth Social talking about
20:17
how you know, how great Tim Cook was,
20:19
even better than Steve Jobs, and you
20:20
know, it's great that he called to kiss
20:22
my ass, and you know, it's okay,
20:23
whatever.
20:24
>> [laughter]
20:26
>> It's definitely been effective, hasn't
20:28
it? Yeah, he definitely has effectively
20:29
managed the Trump administration for
20:30
sure, you know, and saved Apple from a
20:32
lot of a lot of a lot of trouble, a lot
20:33
of heartache. I mean, they're the poster
20:35
child for you know, for offshoring, for
20:36
for Chinese manufacturing, aren't they?
20:38
Well, it was their biggest it was like
20:40
their hallmark, right? Like, wow, look
20:42
at this amazing thing they've done that
20:43
that allowed them to produce all these
20:45
fantastic devices at prices that you can
20:48
actually kind of afford. You know, and
20:50
then it's suddenly it's like, oh, this
20:51
one thing that is the the key element of
20:54
your manufacturing process is now like
20:56
toxic.
20:58
And I mean, it's not just Trump, either.
21:00
I mean, during COVID, you know, it's
21:02
like, holy crap, you know, we we can't
21:04
have all our eggs in one basket, you
21:06
know, for whatever reason, you know,
21:07
whether it's China or anywhere. We can't
21:09
have everything that we consume produced
21:12
in one region. It's just crazy. So, you
21:15
you know, I mean,
21:17
live and learn, right? I mean, yeah,
21:18
Cook put it all in place, and it was
21:20
genius, and you know, I think now
21:22
they're doing smart
21:24
you know, smart like dispersion of that,
21:25
they're bringing some stuff back home,
21:27
moving stuff to other parts of the
21:28
world, and and how the hell did we end
21:30
up talking about all this?
21:32
And I I think it's [laughter] I think
21:33
it's
21:34
it's brought to light the number of
21:37
funnels that are quite narrow in Apple's
21:39
process. Like, yeah, they started
21:40
spinning up you know, more factories in
21:42
India. Now, a lot of the iPhones that
21:44
are sold in the US are made there, but
21:48
you know, all of Apple silicon is made
21:50
by TSMC in Taiwan. That's
21:53
that's another potential problem point.
21:56
Yeah, Apple's incredible in Arizona now?
21:59
They're moving I think they're I don't
22:00
>> they're they're building something
22:01
that'll build but it won't be their
22:03
latest and greatest
22:05
fabrication process, and it'll
22:09
not be at the same scale.
22:10
Um
22:11
and the chips they make will probably be
22:12
more expensive, but it feels like the
22:14
world has realized this is a major
22:16
problem. The most advanced chips that
22:18
anybody makes are only made in one place
22:21
that is not on a um
22:24
very solid political foundation at the
22:26
moment. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, right.
22:28
Well, they they they announced that they
22:29
deal with
22:30
Well, there was a rumor, wasn't there
22:31
with Intel they were going to get Intel
22:32
maybe was going to be manufacturing for
22:34
Apple. Although but that I think is a
22:36
couple of years out. Mhm. There was
22:37
going to be an Intel plant built in Ohio
22:39
that they've
22:40
pretty much abandoned.
22:42
Ah, boy.
22:43
>> Let's let's talk about um
22:45
you know, Cook's ranking.
22:49
You know, Apple's best CEOs, where does
22:50
he fit in the ranking? You know, is he
22:53
Apple's best CEO? There's an argument to
22:55
be made for that, but I don't think so.
22:57
No, I think it's got to belong to Steve
22:58
Jobs. There's just you know, there's no
23:00
way. But he's definitely a close very
23:03
very close second. Um and you know, I
23:06
mean, Jobs pioneered three big
23:08
technological transitions during his
23:09
career. I mean, three huge transitions.
23:12
The first PC, the first really you know,
23:14
first put good personal computer that
23:16
came as a package. Um the first
23:18
easy-to-use PC, the Macintosh, and then
23:20
you know, the game-changing mobile
23:21
computer, the iPhone. Uh and a bunch of
23:23
other products as well. iPod I think
23:25
could be up there as a huge one. Um
23:27
you know, no one can match that that
23:30
run. That is like an unprecedented run
23:32
in in technological history. I don't
23:33
think there's any other CEO uh that can
23:36
that can match, you know, three big
23:38
revolutions like Jobs did. Uh but you
23:40
know,
23:41
look at look at look at the success of
23:43
Apple as a company, you know, like it
23:44
was always a niche player, wasn't it
23:46
under Jobs? It was like a tiny little
23:47
sort of struggling um
23:50
niche PC maker. Um
23:53
but under Cook's tenure, you know, this
23:55
is this is one of the biggest companies
23:56
in the world, and and for several times
23:58
it's been the biggest company, hasn't
23:59
it? Um but anyway, you know, he
24:03
quadrupled Apple's profit to more than
24:04
110 billion. It's market cap has
24:06
ballooned more than 10-fold to 4
24:08
trillion. Uh and this is undoubtedly, I
24:11
think, probably the most successful run
24:13
in business history. Got to be, right?
24:15
Up there. It's got to be up there with
24:16
like the most successfully run business
24:19
ever. Um
24:21
you know, and and I think you know, the
24:22
one thing that they knock against him is
24:24
that he's not a product guy,
24:25
but I think that's not entirely fair. Uh
24:28
and in fact, I think one of the products
24:30
I think could be, you know,
24:32
as important as the iPhone. Um I think
24:35
he's had his fair share of innovative
24:36
devices. AirPods, you know, I think
24:38
AirPods are as good as a product as
24:40
Apple's ever made. Apple silicon, that
24:42
is a game-changer, and I think it's only
24:44
going to become more important. Uh the
24:46
current Mac lineup is the best it's ever
24:48
been. The iPod you know, and I think
24:49
that's true of all the other stuff, too.
24:50
All the other products they make, the
24:51
iPhones are the best they've ever been.
24:53
The iPads are the best they've ever
24:54
been. Um and the Apple Watch. I think
24:57
the Apple Watch is a is a big big
24:58
device. I think you know, like it's
25:00
already turned into a life-saving
25:01
device, and I think it's only going to
25:02
become
25:03
even more of a life-saving device. And I
25:04
think you know, this is possibly a a
25:06
device that I think will be as universal
25:08
as the as a smartphone, you know, I
25:09
think it's a device that I think
25:10
everybody might wear, especially older
25:12
people like us.
25:14
I mean, Tim Tim Cook said it in like
25:16
later this week that the Apple Watch is
25:18
what he's most proud of as a CEO. He
25:21
says Apple Maps was his most
25:22
embarrassing mistake, but the Apple
25:23
Watch he's very very proud of. Right.
25:25
>> Um
25:26
some a reaction I had after reading your
25:28
piece here.
25:29
Um
25:30
Tim Cook is very close second.
25:32
Uh who's in the third place? It's a it's
25:34
a big leap down.
25:36
They Apple has had a lot of mediocre
25:38
CEOs. Uh you know, John Sculley, he did
25:41
okay.
25:42
Everybody else, D-tier trash.
25:45
Well, come on. What about No, no, no.
25:47
What about the first I mean, the early
25:48
ones, you know, Mike Scott and Mike
25:50
Markkula.
25:51
You know, the the the early ones. They I
25:52
I you know, you can't discount those
25:54
guys. I mean, you know, they they they
25:56
they got the the company off the ground
25:57
and turned it into something.
26:00
Mhm.
26:01
>> [laughter]
26:02
>> Not convinced. Yeah, I mean, because the
26:04
products were so unbelievably good, but
26:06
they weren't like, you know, designing
26:07
the products. They were they were the
26:09
CEO of the company, but I mean, Michael
26:10
Scott, he
26:12
he went through a period where he just
26:13
randomly fired people because he felt
26:15
like it when he got pissed off. Like, he
26:17
was not a a good business leader. And he
26:19
said, "And I'm going to keep firing
26:20
people until until morale improves, you
26:23
know?"
26:23
>> [laughter]
26:25
>> That's basically a a quote from him.
26:27
It's in it's in Pogue's book. I don't
26:29
remember it off the top of my head, but
26:30
yeah, it's a it's a long trip down the
26:32
stairs to reach number three.
26:35
Sculley Sculley I think is unfairly, you
26:37
know, maligned. I think, you know, he he
26:39
he he he also oversaw a period of huge
26:41
growth. I mean, he turned it from I
26:42
think it was like 800 million to 8
26:45
billion or something. I can't remember
26:46
the exact numbers, but it was
26:48
you know, something like you know, the
26:50
the those orders of magnitude
26:52
type uh
26:54
uh increases, and and of course, you
26:56
know, like he he did the the Newton is
26:57
is is maligned, but that's I think laid
26:59
the foundations for a a you know, a lot
27:01
of the subsequent products. I think the
27:05
Alexander Hamilton of Apple history, the
27:07
the person who had a lot of early
27:09
influence, but always surprises me was
27:11
never actually CEO, was Jean-Louis
27:13
Gassée, who led the Macintosh division
27:16
um in the late '80s, early '90s. He was
27:19
the only champion we need to make the
27:21
Macintosh like the the the peak of the
27:23
personal computer in the industry. So,
27:25
he likes spearheaded of like the
27:26
Macintosh II, which absolutely which is
27:30
part of what took Apple to that
27:32
incredible high level during the John
27:33
Sculley era. Um I think he also might
27:36
have been a little bit involved with the
27:37
with the PowerBook, which finally made
27:39
personal computers right. Like, he was
27:41
very influential in that critical
27:43
period. Um he may have over-indexed on
27:46
that plan a little bit, because you
27:47
know, their pursuit of the high end of
27:49
the market cornered them into some small
27:51
market share, but you know, he he was
27:53
very influential in there. Um with
27:55
regards to Tim Cook's role as CEO,
27:58
I've been thinking a lot about this this
27:59
past week, and I think if I were to
28:01
characterize the Steve Jobs and Tim Cook
28:03
eras, it's like Steve Jobs
28:07
built the Saturn V rocket,
28:10
planned a trip to the moon,
28:12
they they took off successfully,
28:14
and then he left about 30 seconds into
28:17
the mission. And then Tim Cook, he took
28:19
over, and perfectly you know, Apple went
28:21
to the Apple went to the moon and back
28:23
in terms of like stock price, influence
28:25
over the world. The iPhone absolutely
28:26
changed the world. And Tim Cook
28:29
piloted the rocket ship on the course
28:30
that was plotted. A lot of Apple's
28:32
success is is due is owed to Tim Cook
28:34
because of his vision of, you know,
28:36
consolidating all this manufacturing in
28:38
China, making sure that they had the
28:39
ability to sell the, you know, billions
28:43
of iPhones and products that they did
28:44
throughout the 2010s. But what I keep
28:47
coming back to is um
28:49
you know, Tim Cook still would have done
28:50
that
28:51
if he was still COO. If Steve Jobs had
28:54
been with us for another few years, Tim
28:56
Cook like
28:57
might have even done better, because he
28:58
would
28:59
be able to continue devoting all of his
29:01
attention to being COO, and not the
29:03
expanded roles of being that replacing
29:05
Steve Jobs demanded of him. It's going
29:08
to be fascinating to see, you know, like
29:10
how Tim Cook does, isn't it? You know,
29:11
the next the next few years, because
29:13
it's it's like I think I'm not really a
29:15
huge subscriber to the great man of
29:17
history, you know, this this theory that
29:19
it's all about you know, this is
29:20
obviously a large organization, and
29:22
we're going to talk about this in a
29:23
minute about, you know, Tim Cook's sort
29:24
of decision-making process.
29:26
Um I think he was I think he was the
29:28
right guy at the right time. In that
29:30
that was a period where Steve Jobs like
29:32
built out this this this plan for them.
29:34
These are the the amazing products. Tim
29:35
Cook, you need to make sure we sell as
29:37
many of them as we can, and you know,
29:39
take us to the next level. But I think
29:41
now that they've reached that that that
29:43
peak, that plateau, I think now it is
29:45
time for somebody who's a who's a
29:47
product guy to be you know back at the
29:49
helm and say okay well this is what's
29:51
going to be new this is what's coming up
29:53
next. Absolutely because I think you
29:54
know the the products are going to with
29:56
AI the products are changing I think
29:58
more radically than possibly ever
29:59
before.
30:00
And
30:02
you know that the the next few
30:03
generations of of uh
30:06
of personal products personal computers
30:08
personal devices are going to be very
30:10
very different. And
30:13
yeah it's going to be fascinating to see
30:15
see what they come up with and and this
30:16
is interesting I think with Johnny
30:17
Srouji's um
30:19
promotion too to being head of hardware.
30:21
He's an AI guy. Look at look at Apple
30:23
silicon. It's it you know they they were
30:24
putting they were putting neural engines
30:26
when 5 years ago before AI was the hype.
30:29
>> Oh 2017.
30:31
First one was the iPhone 10. Yeah yeah
30:33
yeah yeah. So you know I think there's a
30:35
lot of AI expertise now at the top of
30:37
Apple and and so at least AI you know
30:40
that they're AI aware. They're AI
30:42
cognizant. And um
30:45
it's uh
30:46
yeah I think that you know that that
30:48
they are two very very good people to
30:50
you know that Apple's leadership is is
30:51
in a very very good position to
30:52
capitalize on this. One of the things
30:53
actually I wanted to to discuss with
30:55
quickly before we move on is like you
30:56
know I mean people are sort of saying
30:58
like Jobs had these major world changing
31:01
platforms like the iPhone like um
31:03
the Mac and that Tim Cook hasn't come up
31:06
with a similar similar world changing
31:07
product if we discount you know if you
31:08
if you if you discount the Apple Watch.
31:10
Um but I think you know who has which
31:13
other company has come up with a world
31:15
changing product in the last
31:17
10 years to to to rival the iPhone? I
31:19
don't think there is one. I mean AI
31:20
obviously but this is you know
31:22
this is sort of an industrial like it's
31:24
it's a it's not just a product it's a
31:26
you know what what do you call it? It's
31:27
not like a single product is it? Like a
31:30
a physical gadget. It's an enabling
31:33
technology that is going to impact
31:35
everything.
31:37
Uh horizontally right across every
31:39
single industry every single human
31:41
endeavor. Um I can't think of a you know
31:44
maybe electric car self-driving cars
31:47
maybe I don't know.
31:48
>> Yeah I was going to say maybe maybe
31:49
Tesla.
31:51
I mean
31:52
But Tesla's getting out of the car
31:53
business now isn't it? They're getting
31:55
lunch eaten by the Chinese so Well yeah
31:57
but they
31:59
made them you know
32:02
they made them seem possible right? I
32:03
mean before that it's like there's no
32:06
such thing. People forget that in the
32:08
2000s there were electric cars they were
32:10
just really crummy and terrible because
32:12
they were trying to build a cheap
32:13
electric car. Like no it was not
32:16
possible to build a $25,000 electric car
32:19
that could go more than like 50 miles.
32:21
You know that Tesla's innovation was the
32:23
business plan of
32:25
start low volume very high profit margin
32:28
with the Tesla roadster then ease your
32:30
way down into like $100,000
32:32
luxury sedan
32:34
then you can make the Model 3 that'll
32:37
you know sell in the hundreds and
32:38
hundreds of thousands a year.
32:39
>> Um and as I say this is this is I think
32:42
that's probably the biggest bust under
32:43
Cook's leadership was the 10 billion
32:45
they reported the Apple car. Yeah uh and
32:48
and you know I mean I'm I'm sure they
32:50
got a lot of
32:51
behind the scenes a lot of AI expertise
32:54
um
32:55
and I think he said that it was like
32:56
that the car was the mother of all AI
32:58
projects and I'm sure that they've
32:59
learned a lot from the car that they've
33:00
applied to other products. It was a
33:02
reasonable thing to explore at the time
33:03
it just
33:04
>> yeah yeah yeah. I'm bummed that they
33:06
they uh they never came out with it you
33:07
know I
33:08
But
33:09
there was a report that came out when
33:10
was it earlier this year
33:12
talking about well Jony Ive was running
33:15
it and
33:16
apparently it was it was it was
33:18
progressing it was what Dan Riccio's
33:21
idea?
33:22
I think he was the one that pitched it
33:23
and then he ran it for a little while
33:25
and and and I believe that his ambition
33:27
was was something like along Tesla's
33:29
lines that it was going to be AI-ish or
33:31
or you know semi-autonomous it wasn't
33:33
going to be a fully autonomous vehicle.
33:34
Um it was going to have smart driving
33:37
capabilities and and that they would
33:39
iterate you know like the first one
33:41
would would be sort of relatively modest
33:42
in what it would do it would be like a
33:44
more like a regular electric car. But
33:46
then Jony Ive came in and said well no
33:49
we want to totally reinvent the car. We
33:51
want no steering wheel no pedals. It's
33:53
going to be fully autonomous. He blew it
33:56
up
33:57
and it never recovered. This is what the
33:59
this report said and so
34:01
I don't know you know it sounds like
34:03
maybe it was Jony Ive's problem not Tim
34:05
Cook.
34:06
I mean I I think that was a that goes
34:08
back to a problem with the Steve Jobs to
34:10
Tim Cook transition. Losing Steve Jobs
34:13
Tim Cook had to hold on to Jony Ive
34:15
because he was afraid that you know the
34:16
talk the stock would tank if you know
34:20
Jony Ive left as well and I think they
34:23
ended up keeping um keeping Jony Ive on
34:27
long after his welcome because you know
34:29
he blew up the car project. He also blew
34:31
up the MacBook Pro for like a solid 5
34:33
years. Nobody liked them.
34:36
>> [laughter]
34:37
>> It's funny how Jony Ive's turned into a
34:38
villain now isn't it? Yeah yeah.
34:41
Well actually this this kind of segues
34:43
into the next thing we were going to
34:44
talk about which is is the is the
34:46
decision making process.
34:47
Right? Um
34:49
A report came out earlier this week from
34:51
our friend Mr. Gurman
34:53
at Bloomberg who said that uh
34:56
uh you know Turnus is going to be more
34:57
decisive than Cook.
34:59
Yeah so Turnus's management style is
35:02
traditional in that he's willing to make
35:04
uh clear direct calls. Colleagues told
35:06
Mark Gurman uh quote Turnus will make
35:09
decisions.
35:11
That's a good thing. That's a good
35:12
thing.
35:13
>> Yeah okay.
35:14
>> [laughter]
35:14
>> Uh you know I mean the clear
35:15
differentiator Tim Cook is more likely
35:17
to build a consensus among top Apple
35:18
executives about the best course rather
35:21
than making the call alone. Turnus's
35:23
approach may echo elements of Apple
35:25
co-founder Steve Jobs' leadership which
35:27
is defined by strong individual decision
35:29
making and a clear product vision. Well
35:31
that's kind of what they needed with the
35:32
Apple car wasn't it? That sounds exactly
35:34
like what what happened you know they're
35:35
wishy-washy flip-flopping going one way
35:37
then back you know no clear no clear uh
35:41
or at least he changed his mind you know
35:42
midway through.
35:44
But I think this is the this is the
35:46
right time for this to happen. I mean I
35:48
actually think like 3 years ago would
35:49
have been the right time for this to
35:50
happen but you know the next the second
35:51
best time is now. I mean it's good to
35:53
have a a clear decision maker someone
35:56
who is an engineer who also knows like
35:57
what is possible what is reasonable to
35:59
ask of Apple engineers who comes from
36:01
that division who's not just going to
36:02
say and I want you to build me this
36:04
thing and
36:06
but it wasn't realistic yeah. Wasn't
36:08
that Jobs wasn't that his superpower? He
36:11
would tell people hey I want you to do
36:12
this and and in fact I mean that
36:14
came caused some devices to not work
36:17
properly right? But he he said hey I I I
36:19
want it to do this.
36:21
You need to do it this way and then the
36:22
engineers like what we can't how do we
36:25
So I don't know. I mean that's
36:28
the one thing that I've always heard
36:29
about Steve Jobs and maybe you just go
36:31
God what a you know what a pain it would
36:33
have been to work with him if if if he's
36:35
telling you to do things that just you
36:37
know bend the laws of physics.
36:39
Yeah but I I think I think
36:41
I think it's better than leading by
36:42
committee having everybody you know
36:44
everybody agree on what is the best
36:46
course forward because you know yeah
36:47
you'll you'll you'll make some good you
36:49
won't make any massive mistakes but you
36:51
you won't have that decisive opinionated
36:54
voice at the top that I think is a
36:55
quintessential
36:57
feature of Apple culture. Yeah. Well
37:00
I went back and I I was reading my own
37:02
book you know about Jony Ive and um
37:04
>> [laughter]
37:04
>> You wrote a book about Jony Ive?
37:06
Well one of the funny things that I'd
37:08
forgotten was um
37:10
Apple under the Scully era was very sort
37:13
of bottom up. It was um
37:16
it was a lot of decisions came from the
37:17
rank and file and they had the the way
37:20
they developed new products is they had
37:21
three documents. There was a marketing
37:23
document um there was a an engineering
37:27
document and um a user experience
37:29
document.
37:30
So these three different and they were
37:32
all written by committees so there was a
37:33
committee would would would weigh in on
37:36
whatever they would product they're
37:37
trying to develop. And and then they
37:40
would you know take all these three
37:41
these three documents and then and
37:42
decide whether to pursue a product or
37:44
not and the the
37:46
um it was like um
37:48
they were described as what was possible
37:50
that was the engineering what was
37:52
desirable that was the
37:54
user experience and
37:56
what people wanted was the marketing
37:57
part. Uh and it was kind of this this
38:00
kind of decision making by committee and
38:01
and of course one of the big problems
38:02
with Apple in that era was that they had
38:04
75 different versions of everything you
38:06
know like there was 75 different kind of
38:08
Macs and it like which one do you
38:09
choose? It was impossible. And this is
38:11
what Jobs blew up and and this is kind
38:13
of a little bit reminiscent maybe of the
38:14
Tim Cook era like look look at the iPod
38:16
lineup you know like I don't know it
38:19
it I I think I don't know I'm not 100%
38:21
convinced of my in what I'm saying.
38:23
>> [laughter]
38:23
>> Cuz on the one hand I think with the
38:25
iPod with the iPod with almost all of
38:27
Apple's products now there are clear
38:28
product there are clear price tiers
38:30
aren't there? And I think a a lot of it
38:31
has to do with with hitting price tiers
38:33
and that people go in and they say okay
38:34
I'm going to spend you know 350 bucks or
38:36
whatever on an iPod and there's a iPod
38:38
at 350 bucks or I can afford a $600 iPod
38:41
or a $1000 iPod. And I think that's part
38:44
of what is driving Apple's current
38:46
product strategy.
38:47
>> the iPod strategy I think where that
38:48
where that comes from is that like we
38:50
need to have an iPod at every $50
38:53
increment. If I have $50 I can buy an
38:55
iPod shuffle if I have $100 I can buy
38:56
the more expensive iPod shuffle with
38:58
more space. If I have $150 I can buy
39:00
this I can buy that I can buy that up
39:02
all the way up to like the you know
39:04
maximum 50 gigabyte iPod classic. But
39:07
maybe what what separates the iPod the
39:10
way that iPod lineup was structured to
39:11
the iPad lineup and the MacBook lineup
39:13
is that you know there was a very clear
39:16
you know linear progression this iPod is
39:18
obviously better in every way than the
39:19
one below it. Whereas when you get into
39:21
the you know computers it's like oh well
39:24
what's better uh a a Mac mini that's
39:26
configured $2000 or the Mac Studio at
39:29
the same price. Well it's not clear I
39:32
mean this one has a better processor
39:33
this one has more space. I get more
39:35
memory on this one this one has the
39:36
ethernet built in like it's it's a
39:39
little muddier there but I mean
39:41
I think it's a valid like product design
39:43
approach cuz that way everybody feels
39:45
like
39:46
they have something to buy and everybody
39:49
feels like, "Oh, if I spend just a
39:50
little bit more, I can get the slightly
39:51
nicer one."
39:53
Right. [snorts] Yeah, yeah. And I don't
39:54
think it's like a problem like it used
39:55
to be back in the old and you know in
39:57
the in the Scully days. But, one of the
39:59
reasons why they were saying why the
40:01
reason is it was sort of so committee
40:02
driven was because it was a it was a
40:03
reaction to Jobs' management style.
40:05
Well, when Jobs was at the company, he
40:07
was so imperious. He was such a pain in
40:09
the ass that
40:11
when he left, there there was a a
40:13
wholesale revolution and the whole
40:14
company decided they they don't want
40:16
this kind of imperious leadership
40:17
anymore. They wanted to have, you know,
40:20
um consensus. They wanted to have like a
40:22
this kind of committee leadership.
40:23
>> And it and it really didn't work for
40:24
them. Like the the design process was
40:25
the engineers the engineers built
40:27
whatever they wanted really and then
40:29
they just handed off the to the, you
40:30
know, design team to be like, "Okay,
40:32
wrap this in plastic." And that's how
40:33
you end up with the Macintosh LC 520
40:36
series which is one of the ugliest
40:37
computers in the world. It's like a
40:39
gigantic TV-sized screen sitting on top
40:42
of a slightly weird lumpy middle section
40:45
sitting on top of another weird slightly
40:47
lumpy middle It's like a It's like a
40:49
three-tiered cake but flipped upside
40:50
down and square beige. It's It's
40:53
hideous. [laughter]
40:55
>> [snorts]
40:56
>> Yeah, so I I I agree. I think, you know,
40:58
we're turning to that kind of decisive,
40:59
you know, this is where we're going the
41:01
product visionary thing and that and and
41:03
and Tim Cook's description of Turnus,
41:05
you know, I I know that there's
41:06
definitely the heart, the soul, and the
41:08
whatever it was
41:09
is a little bit sort of poetic. If if
41:11
true, you know, um
41:14
it does sound like a a good choice. He
41:16
does sound like a good person to be
41:17
leading the company. I'm kind of
41:18
optimistic about the guy. I I don't know
41:21
if I like him. There's something about
41:22
him kind of rubbed me a bit a little the
41:23
wrong way. Do Do you get that
41:24
impression? You know, I don't know why.
41:27
No, I like I like him. I'm looking
41:28
forward to it.
41:30
This is This is honestly like the most
41:31
optimistic feeling I've been feeling
41:32
about Apple for a long time.
41:34
Yeah. You just don't like the chin,
41:36
Leander.
41:38
It's just definitely the chin.
41:39
>> [laughter]
41:42
>> It reminds me of the tick.
41:46
>> [laughter]
41:47
[gasps]
41:47
>> Oh my god. Well, you're optimistic, so
41:50
is Turnus.
41:51
Yeah.
41:52
Good segue [laughter] there, Leander.
41:55
Yeah, I I
41:56
This is great. This is a comes from
41:58
a report that that German put out this
42:00
week talking about
42:01
an internal all-hands meeting that Apple
42:03
had this week after after the
42:05
announcement where Tim Cook and
42:08
John Turnus got up and and talked about
42:10
it and
42:11
Tim Tim Cook pledged that he's healthy
42:12
and going to be around for a long time,
42:14
which I thought was kind of funny.
42:15
Wasn't it German that had the report
42:16
about Tim Cook had been, you know,
42:18
people said he was shaky or something?
42:19
You remember that? A while back weird
42:22
weird health rumor. I think that was
42:23
German. Anyway,
42:25
the part [snorts] about all that, I mean
42:27
Tim Cook being healthy, being around,
42:28
whatever, blah blah blah. The part that
42:29
I thought was awesome was John Turnus
42:31
gets up there and says, you know, we've
42:33
we've got an incredible road map ahead
42:35
and I'm not exaggerating when I say it's
42:37
the most exciting time to be building
42:38
products and services at Apple in my
42:40
entire career. He He promised that Apple
42:42
will {quote} change the world once
42:44
again.
42:45
You know, I mean that's pretty strong
42:47
statements, you know, he's coming out of
42:48
the shoot hot and uh very optimistic.
42:51
>> [laughter]
42:51
>> He uh He tried to put a positive spin on
42:53
Apple's AI efforts even. He says uh
42:56
"AI is going to create almost unlimited
42:58
potential. We're going to be able to
43:00
keep unlocking possibilities that are
43:01
going to create entirely new
43:03
opportunities for our products and
43:04
services and I'm so excited." He's very
43:06
Everyone at Apple is so excited. He's so
43:08
excited about what that's going to mean
43:10
for our users. I can't wait to see what
43:13
they do with it. Right, yeah. Uh He He
43:17
said they're going to keep focusing on
43:18
the design because design is core to
43:19
what we do at Apple.
43:21
Apple's brought truly incredible design
43:23
to more people than any company in
43:24
history.
43:25
Uh who we are as a company won't change.
43:27
Our mission won't change. You know,
43:29
that's all
43:30
I mean I I can't believe that that that
43:32
this leaked out to the world and people
43:35
got to hear this.
43:36
>> [laughter]
43:37
>> But uh you know, I mean it's I bet the
43:38
person who leaked that got fired.
43:41
They got a They got a raise.
43:43
Uh but uh
43:44
yeah, I mean you've been at companies
43:46
where this kind of thing happens, right?
43:48
And you you know, you're like nervous,
43:50
maybe optimistic, hopeful hoping that
43:52
for the best, and maybe you know this
43:54
guy, maybe you don't. Uh I think that
43:56
would have been a pretty uh pretty good
43:57
thing to hear if you were working at
43:58
Apple. And I know that uh
44:01
I know that it it it must be reassuring
44:03
to uh stockholders and Wall Street, too,
44:05
so.
44:07
He's definitely got the hype down, isn't
44:08
he? You know, like this is this is, you
44:10
know, the hypey stuff. It's like
44:13
cheerleading of the highest order. It's
44:15
not muted. It's not like uh
44:17
it's it's a really rallying the troops.
44:18
One of the questions I had is how did
44:20
they fit everybody into the Steve Jobs
44:21
Theater?
44:22
Well
44:23
>> Yeah, it's not a very big theater, is
44:24
it? They probably used FaceTime.
44:27
>> [laughter]
44:28
>> But uh you know, um
44:30
the other thing about that like the one
44:32
thing that I
44:34
didn't particularly like about Tim Cook
44:37
being the sort of face of Apple and
44:39
leading the show and you know, being the
44:43
you know, the guy on the screen at all
44:44
these events is like
44:46
I always felt like
44:47
they definitely tried to get Tim to get
44:50
hyped up about things, you know. It It
44:52
It never never seemed natural to me. It
44:54
seemed like I mean I'm sure he's
44:56
legitimately psyched up about, you know,
44:58
the Apple Watch and that and all the
45:00
ways it helped people. And
45:02
you know, I'm sure he was absolutely
45:04
thrilled when YouTube played it at
45:06
Apple, you know, headquarters. But,
45:09
I think that
45:10
Turnus, I don't know. He seems more like
45:13
he has more genuine charisma than than
45:15
Tim has. I mean I I say that with no
45:17
disrespect to Tim Cook. I'm not a
45:18
fountain of charisma myself. But
45:21
>> Go back and look at some of Cook's first
45:23
keynotes. That That That awful The poor
45:25
guy, he's so nervous. He's palpably
45:28
sweating bullets. It's awful, you know,
45:29
he's he's not comfortable at all. I will
45:32
say I was um
45:34
when I was doing my my recent edit of
45:36
like, you know, 50 years of Apple and
45:38
like whatever minutes um I was watching
45:41
through a lot of the keynotes, you know,
45:42
in order obviously, and I was actually
45:44
really surprised that the later
45:46
in-person events like 2017, 2018, 2019,
45:50
Tim Cook actually did have quite amount
45:52
of like
45:54
excitement and energy behind his behind
45:55
his voice. I think like the switch to
45:57
the virtual events
45:59
killed the momentum that he was
46:00
building. Like it they they just don't
46:02
do him any favors because they're it's
46:04
just like doing them one after another
46:06
not to a crowd of people cheering but to
46:09
a camera crew Right. recording him as he
46:11
reads a script and they're just so
46:14
pre-produced. You know, we asked you do
46:16
the same line like 50 times probably.
46:18
Like
46:20
the pre-recorded events don't do him any
46:21
favors but like I don't know. Watch a
46:23
few minutes of him speaking at like WWDC
46:25
2019 and
46:26
he actually does have like, you know,
46:28
emotion.
46:29
That's crazy.
46:30
>> [laughter]
46:31
>> But also a couple of I I was also
46:32
watching a
46:33
I can't remember which part of it was
46:34
but it was they did a a canned spot
46:36
where um
46:37
someone tries to break into the
46:39
spaceship headquarters to steal
46:41
something out of from a vault. Which one
46:43
was that? Was it uh That's when they But
46:44
they
46:45
They brought the
46:47
uh Apple Silicon to the iPad, isn't that
46:49
what that was?
46:50
Wasn't it Tim And he pulls off he pulls
46:52
off a mask and then he does this kind of
46:54
thing with his head. It was It was
46:56
actually generally funny, I thought, and
46:57
and showed a like a good sense of humor.
46:59
Mhm. Yeah, I I I mean I
47:02
I I didn't mean any of that as like
47:03
disrespectful to Cook. I think he's I
47:05
think he's probably a genuinely nice guy
47:07
and I just feel like he got admitted
47:10
himself. Yeah, I think he got pushed
47:12
into being this, you know, thing that he
47:14
maybe was not naturally. And you know,
47:17
it just happens, right? I mean so I mean
47:20
you watch those old videos of uh
47:22
of Steve Jobs
47:24
you know, showing off a new product. I
47:25
mean
47:26
he was like a freaking stage actor. I
47:29
mean he just he he his timing was
47:30
perfect. Everything about it was
47:32
perfect, you know, and he you could tell
47:33
he had a sense of humor. If something
47:35
went wrong, he laughed at it in a
47:36
convincing way. Uh
47:39
you know, I I What was it? Talking about
47:41
I was just watching this this week, you
47:42
know, reading
47:44
today Apple history post and about
47:46
when they showed off the iPhone 4 after
47:49
the leak, you know, and
47:51
Jobs is up there. He's like, "You know,
47:52
this is the iPhone 4." He's like, "You
47:54
know,
47:55
maybe you've seen this before."
47:57
You know,
47:58
>> [laughter]
47:58
>> cuz they just had the like the biggest
48:00
leak ever in Apple history when some
48:02
dope dopey guy like left a left a
48:05
prototype in a bar and uh
48:08
Gizmodo got [laughter] a hold of it. But
48:09
so so Jobs says that
48:11
which is a a great joke, you know,
48:12
everybody laughs. And he's And then his
48:14
very next move though was brilliant.
48:16
He's like,
48:17
"Trust me, you haven't seen this." And
48:19
it's like
48:20
you
48:21
you know, I I don't
48:22
I don't think that somebody wrote that
48:24
for Steve Jobs. I think Steve Jobs
48:27
had that way of communicating. It just
48:30
naturally.
48:32
I don't think you can I don't think you
48:33
can fake that.
48:35
It's not Steve Jobs was It It doesn't
48:37
come with the job of CEO that you need
48:39
to do these media events. It's just
48:40
Steve Jobs was so good at it that it
48:43
just set the expectation, "Okay, this is
48:45
what the This is just the job of the CEO
48:47
of Apple, whoever that is. Every CEO of
48:50
Apple has to do this." And Tim Cook
48:51
just, you know, was not
48:53
was not ready for that particular role.
48:55
Well, [snorts] you know, Tim Cook's
48:57
keynotes actually sort of, you know,
48:58
reveal something about the way he ran
49:00
the company, right? Isn't it? You know,
49:01
he he was able to He brought in all
49:03
these different kinds of characters.
49:04
They got
49:05
you know, when Jobs' keynotes, it was
49:07
usually just Jobs and then occasionally
49:09
he would bring in um Schiller. Uh you
49:12
know, Schiller, yeah.
49:14
I I He had He had a few other people,
49:15
too, on stage every now and again. Like
49:17
I remember
49:18
Peter Hardy went on stage and he was a
49:20
QuickTime guy.
49:21
Every now and again. But they they they
49:22
were small appearances and they would
49:23
often just be there for a couple of
49:25
minutes just to demo something. Uh and
49:27
of course he would have
49:29
CEOs from other companies if there was a
49:31
game or something they wanted to show
49:32
off or
49:33
some partnership with Google or
49:35
whatever.
49:36
Intel, you know, like when the Intel
49:38
transition, but it was usually Jobs. And
49:39
but you know, the Tim Cook though uh
49:41
every time there was a a whole bunch of
49:43
people I think almost more and more like
49:45
some of them would there's a cast of
49:46
thousands
49:47
um would come out. And I like that. I I
49:50
liked it that it acknowledged that um
49:53
it was a big company and there was a lot
49:56
of people involved, different people
49:57
involved and get different people get to
49:58
get to share the limelight and get a
49:59
little bit of the credit. Um Jobs was
50:01
always afraid I think
50:03
his stated rationale was that he didn't
50:04
want to get people poached. That um
50:07
competition would I believe so, yeah.
50:10
Um
50:11
but there was also definitely a the
50:13
showman part of it too, you know, like
50:14
he knew that he was
50:16
he was doing a good job and maybe didn't
50:17
want to share the limelight with others
50:19
or or that just wasn't his MO. I don't
50:20
know if that that was driven by ego.
50:23
Um
50:24
Uh they were definitely very successful,
50:25
weren't they? I mean, there was no
50:26
question about it. Although I you know,
50:28
I I attended almost all those keynotes
50:29
over from when I was working when I was
50:31
a reporter for Wired and
50:33
um
50:34
I know this is blasphemous, but you
50:37
know,
50:38
that often people were impatient and
50:40
they just wanted to get to the one more
50:41
thing.
50:42
Um and sometimes you'd have to sit there
50:44
through like a I remember um the
50:46
postcards, the iCloud postcards or
50:49
something like that. iCard, yeah. iCards
50:51
>> [laughter]
50:51
>> iCards
50:52
>> Yeah. I I that one people were like, for
50:55
God's sake, when is this [laughter]
50:56
going to end, you know? Mhm. Uh
50:59
they were it wasn't all, you know, super
51:01
showmanship. Um there was definitely a
51:03
lot of uh
51:05
you know, stuff that that wasn't so
51:06
memorable.
51:07
>> stretch there he would open every
51:08
keynote with like an update on the Apple
51:10
stores, like how stores are doing, how
51:12
many sales they're having, how many
51:13
stores they're opening. It's like, yeah,
51:15
okay. The first Apple store was
51:17
interesting, but yeah. At least it was
51:18
fairly quick, you know, but
51:20
they would often like the sort of meat
51:21
of the show. I think that like you said,
51:23
it was true.
51:24
That stuff went really pretty quickly
51:26
and I didn't think it was too bad. Um
51:28
but uh it you know, uh
51:31
it wasn't all
51:32
it wasn't all, you know, super
51:34
showmanship. There was definitely some
51:35
sort of forgettable ones in there. Yeah,
51:37
well, that's true. I mean, you know,
51:38
we're watching clips, right? We're
51:40
watching 2 minutes that were
51:41
astonishing. And then there was, you
51:43
know,
51:44
45 more minutes on how all the great new
51:47
features in Safari or something.
51:49
Yeah. Or or also we're watching it in
51:51
hindsight. We're like, yeah,
51:53
watching the unveiling of iCal isn't
51:55
interesting to us because every calendar
51:57
app works like that now, but you know,
51:59
when it was new, when it was being shown
52:01
off for the first time, it was
52:02
impressive.
52:03
Mhm. I went back and watched um the
52:05
MacBook Air, the first MacBook Air one.
52:08
Oh, that's a good one.
52:08
>> And yeah, that one's a classic one. And
52:11
you know, it was actually very, very
52:13
enjoyable. I sat there and watched it
52:14
for like a good 10 minutes. I I was
52:16
hooked. I was, you know, like on the
52:18
edge of my seat. I maybe I shouldn't
52:20
admit this to my bosses, but I can't
52:21
tell you how often it's like, oh, I'm
52:23
researching a how-to article and I it's
52:25
it it's a mistake I make every time
52:26
where I start playing a few minutes of a
52:28
keynote video and then an hour has
52:31
passed.
52:32
>> [laughter]
52:32
>> That's great.
52:34
Is there anything else we should discuss
52:36
about, you know, Turnus and Cook? I I
52:37
think we have kind of
52:40
talked about every angle that you could
52:41
think of. Well, we don't know what kind
52:43
of shoes Turnus wears, do we?
52:45
Oh.
52:46
>> [laughter]
52:48
>> Well, wasn't he wearing he was in some
52:50
sneakers, wasn't some fancy sneakers? I
52:52
saw that someone did an analysis, they
52:53
used um image lookup or what's it
52:55
called? In Apple intelligence feature, I
52:57
can't remember what it's called.
52:59
>> Yeah, and they were some original Nike
53:01
Air Jordans, right? Or something, I
53:03
can't remember.
53:04
He's definitely a sneakerhead. I know
53:06
that people were going crazy like when
53:07
he was in New York recently, he had some
53:08
unreleased um Travis Scott sneakers or
53:11
something like that.
53:12
>> [laughter]
53:13
>> It's it's weird. Like this is a minor
53:15
point, but in the top of the press
53:18
release that announces Tim, you know,
53:21
the transition
53:22
John Turnus and Tim Cook are wearing the
53:23
exact same clothes, same blue
53:25
button-down shirt, same jeans. The only
53:28
difference is their sneakers and like
53:31
did no one see that coming? Like how
53:32
weird it looks?
53:34
Well, there was a there was a time,
53:35
wasn't there when I I know we did an
53:36
analysis at Wired I think when of the
53:38
shirts that they wore the keynotes.
53:41
Um you know, uh they were all wearing
53:43
the same sort of shiny shirts with the
53:45
with the sleeves half rolled up,
53:46
untucked.
53:48
Um and uh that was get a little bit
53:51
weird.
53:52
What I'm curious about is that usually
53:53
in a in an Apple keynote video, Tim Cook
53:55
wears the button-down shirts, but John
53:56
Turnus is almost always just wearing
53:58
like a a tight t-shirt. And I wonder if
54:00
now that he's CEO, he'll change. Maybe
54:02
he has to like upgrade to a to a
54:04
button-down or if he'll or if he'll keep
54:06
the t-shirt going.
54:08
Yeah, they they both look pretty buff
54:10
too, don't they? I mean, they've got no
54:11
body fat really between them.
54:14
Yeah, oh my god. Look at those guys.
54:16
Rich [snorts] as can be. And you're
54:18
right, Griffin, they do look almost
54:19
indistinguishable from one another, but
54:21
one has white shoes and one has black.
54:22
What does it mean?
54:25
>> [laughter]
54:27
>> Let's maybe talk about the the other two
54:28
things that happened this week.
54:31
Yeah, yeah,
54:32
big you know,
54:34
interesting week about the iPhone 18 Pro
54:37
color lineup. Supposedly the new color
54:39
is going to be dark cherry. And uh sadly
54:43
for everyone else that doesn't have one,
54:45
cosmic orange is going to go away
54:46
supposedly, despite having been a huge
54:48
hit apparently everywhere.
54:50
Uh especially in
54:52
what did I hear? Asia, maybe China and
54:55
Japan in particular. Anyway, iPhone 18
54:58
Pro and Pro Max expected launch in four
54:59
colors. Dark cherry as mentioned, light
55:02
blue.
55:03
You won't believe this, dark gray. And
55:05
oh my god, you're kidding me, silver.
55:09
>> [laughter]
55:09
>> Well, the the 17 Pro doesn't come in a
55:11
dark gray, so that actually is a
55:12
surprise. You know, they're bringing it
55:14
back. Yeah, I you know,
55:15
>> Light blue, I'm looking forward to that.
55:17
I think that'll be a good color.
55:18
>> It'll be whitish, bluish white.
55:22
I was expecting it to be like when I
55:24
heard when I read dark cherry, I was
55:25
like, oh, you know, kind of like a
55:27
maroon color, but all of these leaks
55:29
come with like a an official Pantone
55:31
color with them that they're going to
55:32
match and it's really very purply. You
55:35
know, kind of like eggplant
55:37
eggplant color.
55:39
Dark cherry certainly sounds better than
55:41
eggplant. But but yeah, it doesn't look
55:42
very cherry to be quite honest. Uh No.
55:45
Then again, the deep purple phone didn't
55:47
look very purple, so who knows?
55:49
>> it's not very dark either. It's a very
55:50
like sort of medium gray purple, but
55:53
I don't know. I have I have renders in
55:55
the in the article that I that I color
55:57
corrected to match the Pantone color and
56:00
um very purply.
56:02
Yeah. Yeah,
56:03
this like I said, this comes from I
56:05
think I said this
56:06
report from Macworld. Uh they said that
56:09
the dark cherry is going to be a deep
56:12
wine-like red that will be quote much
56:16
closer to wine than fruit punch.
56:19
Okay, [laughter] well, just just for
56:21
starters,
56:23
wine all kinds of wine looks very
56:24
different. So, you know,
56:27
I don't think they nailed that down
56:29
quite as much as they'd like. Uh
56:31
Here are the other colors, blah blah
56:32
blah. I think the other part of this
56:35
uh
56:36
report was that the folding phone is
56:38
supposedly going to come I think only in
56:41
like
56:42
black and white or silver and black or
56:44
gray and you know, basically, you know,
56:47
the most basic colors possible, so. But
56:49
that uh you know, it's nice to if you go
56:51
to the website and you look at the uh
56:53
picture, you'll get a look at maybe what
56:54
the iPhone 18 Pro is going to look like,
56:57
although almost guaranteed it's not
56:59
going to look that bright unless you're
57:00
in direct sunlight.
57:03
Yeah, I mean,
57:04
the the Pantone color that they
57:05
referenced doesn't match that
57:07
description at all cuz it's very purply.
57:09
Yeah, I don't know. We'll see. I mean,
57:11
we've been hearing rumors about a dark
57:13
red or a deep red for for ages, right?
57:17
So,
57:18
not surprising that they would go that
57:20
route.
57:20
>> to switch it up like because Ed in our
57:22
Slack was like, oh, but the orange has
57:24
been so successful, why would they kill
57:25
it? I don't think it's anything about
57:28
the color orange specifically that
57:30
people love. Like nobody really loves
57:32
the color orange other than like Stephen
57:33
Hackett. It's just the fact that it was
57:36
it was bright and colorful. So, yeah,
57:38
they should change it up every year. So,
57:39
that way, you know, you can identify,
57:41
oh, that's the new phone because it's
57:43
the new color.
57:44
And I can tell because it's a color that
57:45
I can see. This is the first thing that
57:47
John Turnus should change. My god.
57:50
Yeah, yeah, it
57:53
Pop colors on iPhones. Are you
57:55
listening, John?
57:56
Uh
57:56
>> [laughter]
57:57
>> we did we did a um a survey in the
57:59
newsletter about and it seemed like blue
58:01
blue is what people want. A nice nice
58:03
shade of blue. Everyone wants blue,
58:05
blue, blue, blue. I think they've done
58:07
blue.
58:09
Uh it's just that it, you know, they
58:11
were the shades of blue were not exactly
58:13
uh
58:14
you know, vivid and they didn't change
58:15
that, you know, one was like what do we
58:17
used to call mom's minivan blue.
58:19
Uh and then the next one was like
58:21
slightly darker, you know, they're just
58:22
they've always been so kind of muted.
58:24
That's why I think people were I mean, I
58:26
was clamoring for it for years. I want
58:28
something flashy. I want something that
58:30
you can tell is a
58:32
you know, a hot rod phone and that's
58:33
what they gave us with the cosmic
58:35
orange. I mean, I'm I'm not the biggest
58:36
fan of cosmic orange and especially the
58:38
the sort of two-tone look with the
58:41
you know, part that's actually orange
58:42
and then the part that's actually more
58:44
like a dreamsicle.
58:45
But uh
58:47
but you know, I mean, yeah, I I got it.
58:49
And and I got to say, I I I get a new
58:51
phone every year, don't really need to.
58:52
Wouldn't if I wasn't on the well, if I
58:54
didn't work for Cult of Mac and if I
58:56
wasn't on the iPhone upgrade program,
58:58
but uh
58:59
you know, I'm going to feel a little bit
59:01
sad handing that thing over and getting
59:03
probably the dark cherry one.
59:07
You think you'll get dark cherry? What
59:08
if they have What if the light blue, you
59:10
know, is is light blue as the rumor
59:11
says? Do you think you would consider
59:12
that one?
59:13
>> you know, light I've been
59:15
not burned, but I mean, I've had the
59:17
light blue iPhone Pro a couple of times
59:20
and it's always just like uh
59:22
I don't know. I mean, I I like I like it
59:24
to look different, you know, it's kind
59:25
of fun. Even though it's just like one
59:27
little section of the phone sticking out
59:28
of the case, it's uh you know, it's a
59:31
reminder. And I mean this is incredibly
59:34
stupid but I you know I remember like
59:36
the first week or two after I you know I
59:39
went to some you know brew pub and we're
59:41
sitting there
59:42
with my wife and a friend and the
59:44
bartender comes up and he goes, "Oh wow,
59:45
is that the new iPhone?" It's like,
59:48
yeah it is.
59:50
>> [laughter]
59:50
>> He's like, "Oh yeah, it's the first one
59:52
I've seen." You know, like yeah okay
59:53
great. You know you know nice you see
59:54
them everywhere. So I mean
59:56
you know that's incredibly shallow but
59:58
it gives you something to talk about.
59:59
It's a conversation piece and
1:00:01
you know
1:00:02
I mean
1:00:03
you know to have something fun in your
1:00:05
life. Why not? I mean light blue to me
1:00:08
boring light blue. It's not going to be
1:00:09
fun.
1:00:10
I hope that the dark cherry is actually
1:00:12
like redder and less purple than it that
1:00:15
the
1:00:16
things that we've seen. So we'll see
1:00:18
soon enough. What is it like
1:00:20
four months away? Oh boy.
1:00:22
Yeah yeah come up real fast. Let's let's
1:00:25
wrap up real quick with the about the
1:00:27
folding iPhone feature that everyone
1:00:28
thought was going to be off the table
1:00:29
but actually now is on the table. Yes.
1:00:32
This was
1:00:33
tragic tragic news that I think we broke
1:00:36
last week that the iPhone dummy units
1:00:39
from Sonny Dickson didn't have the
1:00:41
MagSafe ring on the back. They were on
1:00:44
the other dummy units for the iPhone 18
1:00:45
Pro models that that included it as
1:00:47
well.
1:00:48
But on Sunday tipster Majin Buu posted
1:00:52
on Twitter images claimed to be of cases
1:00:54
for the iPhone Ultra and these do have
1:00:57
MagSafe ring on the back. Now
1:01:00
>> [laughter]
1:01:00
>> this doesn't entirely make the fear go
1:01:02
away because there are a number of weird
1:01:03
things about the images that Majin Buu
1:01:05
posted.
1:01:06
Um
1:01:07
they don't really look like clear cases
1:01:11
Apple has sold before. The the the clear
1:01:14
cases have always been like clear with
1:01:16
like white plastic accents. These are
1:01:18
one of them is clear and black. The
1:01:21
other is clear and orange. Um
1:01:24
very very strange. Apple hasn't made a
1:01:26
clear and orange case and if the rumors
1:01:29
are true that the
1:01:31
that the folding iPhone only comes in
1:01:32
black and white then why would they have
1:01:34
a case that's orange which is last
1:01:36
year's pro color and presumably won't be
1:01:39
represented on any phones much less the
1:01:41
folding phone.
1:01:42
Also
1:01:44
if you look at the orange case in Majin
1:01:47
Buu's hand here
1:01:48
it's weird that it's got this the like
1:01:50
the MagSafe ring on the back.
1:01:52
Kind of it looks like it's it pops out
1:01:54
as like a stand which is something that
1:01:57
third-party cases by like Case Kuu do.
1:02:00
I mean Apple hasn't made a clear case
1:02:01
like that before. Very strange. Also
1:02:05
it it is entirely possible that the
1:02:07
folding iPhone doesn't have MagSafe
1:02:10
inside it but Apple's solution is, "Oh
1:02:12
you just get a case that adds MagSafe to
1:02:14
it."
1:02:15
>> Right. That's what I was going to say.
1:02:18
Yeah, that would make sense. And and you
1:02:19
know what? Having a stand like that
1:02:21
makes more sense if you got something
1:02:23
that folds out and you're going to you
1:02:25
know use it like an iPad mini to watch
1:02:27
watch
1:02:28
you know videos and stuff. So maybe it's
1:02:30
totally true. I mean it would
1:02:33
you know Apple's
1:02:34
>> [laughter]
1:02:34
>> the one thing about Apple is I think
1:02:36
they do think about these things and if
1:02:38
they're
1:02:39
if they're seriously
1:02:41
uh
1:02:42
if they're going to leave MagSafe out
1:02:44
they can say, "Hey, if if you really
1:02:45
want MagSafe just
1:02:47
here's your case." You know, you don't
1:02:48
want a case. And by the way it's got a
1:02:49
stand. Won't that be great?
1:02:51
MagSafe accessories are going to have to
1:02:52
be a little different on it because
1:02:53
every because I mean I tested this on
1:02:56
the on the mock-up that I had that's
1:02:58
probably going to have like very similar
1:02:59
proportions to the to the actual folding
1:03:01
iPhone and there's just not a lot of
1:03:04
room under the camera plateau because
1:03:05
the phone is so much shorter that if you
1:03:08
if you stick an existing MagSafe wallet
1:03:10
or battery or something on it it's going
1:03:13
to stick out beyond the bottom of the
1:03:15
phone. MagSafe chargers that only have
1:03:17
like you know like the ring size element
1:03:19
and and don't have like you know the big
1:03:21
rectangle shape those will probably work
1:03:23
fine and you know that's really all I
1:03:25
need. That's mostly what I use MagSafe
1:03:27
for sticking it on a
1:03:28
sticking it on a charging stand. I don't
1:03:30
use MagSafe wallets. I only occasionally
1:03:32
use MagSafe batteries but um
1:03:35
it's
1:03:36
my my my fear is a little bit dissuaded
1:03:39
based on this leak but not entirely not
1:03:41
entirely gone. I'll probably be worrying
1:03:43
about this until September.
1:03:45
>> [laughter]
1:03:46
>> Yeah it's definitely worrying a lot of
1:03:47
people. I mean MagSafe is one of the key
1:03:48
features and I think that this could
1:03:50
almost be a
1:03:51
a deal killer for some. No MagSafe I'm
1:03:53
not interested.
1:03:55
Mhm.
1:03:56
My mom being one of them.
1:03:57
I mean Apple learned the lesson on the
1:03:59
iPhone 16E that like yeah this is a
1:04:01
budget phone but yep we we can't cut
1:04:03
MagSafe. Everybody will complain about
1:04:05
it. So surely they they know we are not
1:04:08
going to like it if a $2,000 phone
1:04:10
doesn't have a feature that phones have
1:04:11
had since 2020. Plus
1:04:14
70 cent magnet.
1:04:16
>> [laughter]
1:04:16
>> And only a few months away. Yeah.
1:04:19
All right. I think we should wrap it up.
1:04:21
That's about all the Cult of Mac we have
1:04:23
for you this week. Thanks so much
1:04:24
everybody Hold on that's not the name of
1:04:25
our show.
1:04:26
Oh god damn [laughter] it's so hard.
1:04:31
20 years of conditioning. Mhm. Let's try
1:04:34
that again. Okay. I think we should wrap
1:04:36
it up. That's enough of the uh Cult of
1:04:38
Mac podcast
1:04:39
>> [laughter]
1:04:40
>> Easy for you to say.
1:04:42
I could barely get it out.
1:04:43
Please give us a five-star rating at
1:04:45
least five stars [music] maybe six or
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That's [email protected].
1:05:02
Send us questions, comments and
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1:05:14
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1:05:15
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1:05:16
everybody. Goodbye.
1:05:18
See you.